S60R

OK, one more comment from the hand police, I was expecting that. But the twisties at sebring? Get some glasses dude, the only time my hand lingered on the shifter was on the straights and I'm planning on working on that since I concider that a valid critism about my shifter hand.

On the subject of losing control, are you really telling me that you've never tried to kick your rear end out a little on a wet surface, or a dry one for that matter, either for fun or just to test your oversteer and car response?

Every time I felt the rear end starting to slip out too far I pulled it right back in just fine, thank you very much.

I've confessed to pushing the limits of control, it was what I wanted to do, but if you can really sit there and tell me you've never tried to slide a car around I either call that lame or BS.

Car54

Why don't you run video this weekend and post back here to show us your improvements?

I'm only saying this stuff because I know you want to do better but you're having a real hard time accepting some criticisms. I think you should be sure to ask for/demand an instructor when you go out this weekend. You'll improve and you'll have more fun doing it plus you'll be safer.

S60R

The camera will be along as it always is for this weekend's event' and it will be posted. For both myself and the hand, line and safety police I'm sure my harshest critics will be happier I'll be taking all their advice to heart.

So I accept the hand criticisms, its easy to let the street habbit of left hand on wheel and right on shifter, coffee, controls or holding the wheel near my lap kick in when you become distracted. As my Sebring video shows, I never would enter a corner hot and fast with less than two hands on each side of the wheel but on my first few times around I was a little indecisive about shift points and there I did linger for too long on the straights.

Loren or Jeff are welcome for a few ride alongs this weekend if they so desire, but I assume they may have better uses for their time since I will behaving since this is a real event.

The only criticisms I disagree with here is that I was putting the track and lives in dangers for trying to kick my rear end out on wet spots while doing between 35 and 40 MPH on a wide and empty race track and that there is no reason to ever visit that zone for testing and training purposes.

It wasn't racing or pretty, that's not what it was supposed to be, but it was very fun by my standards of automotive mischief.

scott hutch

I would personally not try to test the over steer next time and really just focus on the basics to get a feel for the car

Car54

Have you ever heard the term "slip-angle"? As you come up to speed, you should be flirting with and balancing between understeer/oversteer on every corner. That's how you figure out what your suspension is doing. Upsetting the car with inputs is not telling you anything. Having someone in the right seat help you feel if you're provoking the car or the car is communicating to you is crucial at this point of your learning. The point of an instructor is not about you behaving, it's about coaching you. And that is where I think you're not getting it.

LOL at the above edit.

treekiller

Okay I am staying out of any arguments. but I do not accept safety issues. I am not requiring Tony to do the track orientation session, since I trust the instructors at PBOC and I know they do a good job.. That being said. if ANYONE including Loren or myself Does anything stupid. there will be one warning and then if there is a repeat, immediate ejection from the track.

This is a Test and Tune event.. there are not 3 corner workers at every turn. you HAVE to keep your wits about you.. This weekend is a validity test for future events, I can't risk anyone screwing it up. if it works it's going to bring more future inexpensive track days events to the area. I can't afford anyone being a hooligan. I'll Ride with Tony in the morning. if I see a hint of issue, I'll address it. but I'm sure there will not be a problem. since no one wants to risk ejection without refund.

S60R

Fortunately there's no need for a next time, I've felt it up enough times now and I'm happy with the mods and the way the car responds. Its not like this is some kind of long running experiment, I only got the sways on a couple weeks ago. A few repeated experiments at a few different speeds in a safe and open venue is all I needed to get a feel for a car's oversteering tendencies.

And I know all about slip angle. This is the kind of thing I would just normally go visit the Ray's stadium lot one evening after making my mods to test out, but I'm sure even the super-safety police (not to mention SPPD) would have a lot more issues with me going about things that way.

And I was effectively balancing the oversteer through all the turns to feel it out. If you pay attention the video every time I brake loose I was transitioning from the dryer pavement to the wet areas in the turn exits after I had my momentum aimed down the line to the next straight or corner. I'm not stupid about the risks involved, so if you observe carefully you will also see that I only pushed it once my momentum was aimed down the exit of the turn instead of taking any risks in the mid apex where my runoff room would be much more limited. That way if the car did react badly or I spun out that chances would be good that I would keep it on the pavement.

All this would have been easier if the track was either all wet or all dry, but I did my best to use what I was given.

Perhaps I'm just more paranoid than others about oversteer after owning a very tail happy car where misjudging it was guaranteed to result in an uncontrolled trip off the track ass end leading the way. With the volvo, not so much since I now know its hard to push the back end out too far and its easy to get it back even with the DTSC disabled.

As I said I'm open to advice, but when I hear 'don't ever push your car past its limits', I disagree strongly with the advice of the 'don't touch the limit' crew since that's what solo events and skidpads are for, lol.

Short of solo events and skidpads I will improvise where I can though, and I did.

As Jeff says, this weekend's event is about safety and I agree with that 100%.

scott hutch

so you ask for criticism then shrug it off entirely. You can say you were testing the oversteer as much as you want but you were driving like a pissed off teenager. You were given advise from experienced drivers. Driving for crap is not testing oversteer. If you drove normally and encountered oversteer then fine correct as needed . but you were practicing what would happen if you forgot how to turn. PLEASE take the advise listed by these experienced drivers earlier, and be safe out there. Good luck with the next event.

yamaha731

YouTube - Auto-X @ The Orlando Central Florida Race Complex
I'm not an experienced driver but I know this is not proper driving techniques

TNathe

1)where were his hands before picking up the glass of water?

2)He was demonstrating a point and he IS A PROFESSIONAL, you are NOT.

PS: I didnt see any drifting...or rev matching, or ANY driving maneuvers that belong on a race track for that matter.

Sit here and talk about how you were "pushing the limits" this and that all you want, but your video says too much about how what you are saying is just a bunch of poop.