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What is a 475+ rwhp fc3s worth?

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Old Apr 13, 2011 | 08:48 AM
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3mm seals and doweled motors are just an excuse and a bandaid for shitty tuning. Having some retard at a machine shop dowel your motor is prob going to do more damage to it than good. As for 3mm seals, there is no need for then for that power level, you better have brand new housing it you wanna start that motor on a hot day. They may be better for detonation but have very poor low rpm strting and sealing, not to mention the added weight and chattering they will do at higher rpms. Why do you think mazda went away with them? Thiker isnt always better, shit they started out with 6mm seals found out they sealed poorly, then went to 3mm seals and found put they also had poor low rpm gas sealing.If you want 500whp reliably go check out waterinjection.info look up rice racings car. I'll see if I can find the sae papers i have for the seal changes an reasoning behind it.
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if you havent been in a small plane its worst, cause your eyes and brain say we are moving and your body says oh no we are not. eyes and brain go asshole we are moving, cant you see? body says fuck you we are not moving at all. so they fight and fight and eventualy your body says, you know what fuck you brain, see if you can stop this!! then you throw up.

Last edited by miataspeed; Apr 13, 2011 at 09:00 AM.
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Old Apr 13, 2011 | 09:05 AM
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Waterinjection.info! There's sooooooo much useful and valid info on there from real automotive engineers that daily 5-700hp vehicles. Auxiliary injection is by far the easiest and safest way to make power on our engines!
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if you havent been in a small plane its worst, cause your eyes and brain say we are moving and your body says oh no we are not. eyes and brain go asshole we are moving, cant you see? body says fuck you we are not moving at all. so they fight and fight and eventualy your body says, you know what fuck you brain, see if you can stop this!! then you throw up.
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Old Apr 13, 2011 | 10:25 AM
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Originally Posted by NI_racing
Not to start causing problems, but i feel there are a few things in here that i wont be doing when i get my t2 back together and im curious as to why you would. For starters, why dowel and not pin? I have the Banzai oil pan brace right now as a small structural support and im going to see how helpful that is in the 3-400 whp range before i decide on dowel or pins, but im just curious why you are doweling.
I have the same oil pan brace right now and it seems to hold up fine. And when I said dowel. I meant dowel+pin.


Originally Posted by NI_racing
Secondly, why a T04Z? there are much newer, more efficient turbos out there, that do the same job, only better. I understand that the TO4Z has come down in price especially when compared to the newer turbos, but i dont think that at this point price should be an issue... maybe thats just me?
Their could be newer turbos out their I'm not aware of. Its what I wanted to use over a year ago now. But with the purchase of my new house it kind of got put on the back shelf. This is the kit I was going to go with.

T04Z Turbo Kit RX-7


Originally Posted by NI_racing

As for your injectors, you can get 4 1600cc injector dynamics injectors for ~500 bucks. thats plenty of fuel for anything "street" driven, plus theyre one of if not the best injectors on the market. they stage well and should have no issues being controled by your apexi.
1600 primaries are insane. The secondaries would be ok. But I don't plan on going more than a little more than 500. I hated tuning my 1680s on my second gen. I don't want to go through that again. The math works out just fine with 850/1300 for my power level. I feel any bigger is just a pure waste.

Originally Posted by NI_racing
The last thing is just me and a select few other people i guess... but when i do my setup for AI im just going to be running water, no meth. It'll be pre and post turbo injection. Im really not a big fan of adding "fuel" to the system that is not being measured and taken into consideration by the haltech. I know most people just buy the 50/50 jugs from walmart for a dollar or two and they work fine, im just saying for my piece of mind, i want all my fuel coming from the tank.
Not a expert on meth/water injection. So can't really give any experience or opinion. I just like what I have read so far about the 50/50 mix. As far as the tune goes if you inject at certain points of your map then you know where to add or subtract fuel.

Originally Posted by NI_racing
BTW Buddha, when are you gonna be completed with some of this stuff. its been to long since ive seen your car.
I am about to start a new position in my company that will hopefully give me more time and money to work on it the way it should be worked on.
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Originally Posted by rotarykidd
you have no idea how many TR members id kill to have this car for just a day...
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Old Apr 13, 2011 | 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by miataspeed
3mm seals and doweled motors are just an excuse and a bandaid for shitty tuning. Having some retard at a machine shop dowel your motor is prob going to do more damage to it than good. As for 3mm seals, there is no need for then for that power level, you better have brand new housing it you wanna start that motor on a hot day. They may be better for detonation but have very poor low rpm strting and sealing, not to mention the added weight and chattering they will do at higher rpms. Why do you think mazda went away with them? Thiker isnt always better, shit they started out with 6mm seals found out they sealed poorly, then went to 3mm seals and found put they also had poor low rpm gas sealing.If you want 500whp reliably go check out waterinjection.info look up rice racings car. I'll see if I can find the sae papers i have for the seal changes an reasoning behind it.
Its not just a excuse for bad tuning. Its another level of safety. Doweling+pinning the motor will prevent the keg from twisting out of shape. I don't plan on running new housing if I don't have to. If they can't be recovered and the builder says they need to be replaced I will. But to ensure it last longer I will add the extra protection. The chattering you are speaking of also has to do with the springs and the type of seal you use. If you use some cheap 3mm seal + spring expect cheap results. But if you plan to drop 2k on just apex seals + springs. That is a different matter. Added weight can be easily adjusted if you have your rotating assemble balanced you will be fine. And just for your info I'm not sending my motor to just any machine shop. I will send it out of state to a bigger name shop. Not uncle charlie at the corner of dale marby and fletcher.


Good website btw.
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Originally Posted by rotarykidd
you have no idea how many TR members id kill to have this car for just a day...

Last edited by Rotary Buddha; Apr 13, 2011 at 10:41 AM.
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Old Apr 13, 2011 | 10:41 AM
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Also for everyone that ever has thought or loved rotaries you should read this book.

Street Rotary by Mark Warner | Free Shipping at DeepDiscount.com

Also same author but about turbos.
Street Turbocharging by Mark Warner | Free Shipping at DeepDiscount.com
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Originally Posted by rotarykidd
you have no idea how many TR members id kill to have this car for just a day...
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Old Apr 13, 2011 | 01:10 PM
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Rice Racing prepared 13B-REW short blocks

By far one of the best non-japanese tuner of high hp rotarys
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if you havent been in a small plane its worst, cause your eyes and brain say we are moving and your body says oh no we are not. eyes and brain go asshole we are moving, cant you see? body says fuck you we are not moving at all. so they fight and fight and eventualy your body says, you know what fuck you brain, see if you can stop this!! then you throw up.
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Old Apr 14, 2011 | 06:27 AM
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I fell in love with Rice Racing... just wish the guy wasnt such a dick at times, but he knows what hes doing. I intend to copy his mechanical water injection setup to the T. Im a big fan of pre turbo application and figured one post turbo wouldnt hurt either. Preciate the website tho Zack cuz i couldnt remember what it was off the top of my head. Buddha i own a fair amount of rotary books including street rotary, and while its a good book for general knowledge, quite a bit of it came from members of 7 club. Not saying that those people are not smart on the rotary as i use it as a resource all the time when im tinkering with stuff, but they are very reluctant to get into anything crazy in depth. I also have a wonderful book on building custom intake and exhaust systems for various applications based on velocity and flow and wave timing and all that good stuff. I have various how to Rotary dvds. I have templates. Ive read all about the various seals available and feel that the 3mm seals are only useful when your rotor is beyond capable of holding a 2mm properly. I have been all over Rices porting templates as well as Judge Ito and his lil flip for the NA ports. Ive contemplated hunders and hundreds of high horsepower rotary builds in my head. Mapped out systems for it. designed intake and exhaust systems for various ports and power levels. different suspension setups for various track cars. I spend the majority of my time at work going over rotary performance in my head and while ive never put any of it to practical use, i am very familar with the concepts and theories.

One more comment on the 1600cc all around. Injector Dynamics are wonderful injectors. Not like 95% of the "great" injectors on the market. The spray pattern and pintle design are phenominal. They stage well. have almost no issues. 900whp supras are running 2000cc all the way around with no idle issues... no around the town drivability issues that im aware of. There doesnt seem to be any lag and dwell issues from idle to WOT. I understand that people arent used to these injectors yet due to the price and the all... but i honestly was contemplating running 2000cc all the way around... till i realized i would never be able to ever capitalize on the power potential in a street application. I figured 1600 would give me plenty for street and if i ever decided i needed more power for track i wouldnt have to worry about fuel supply issues. BTW, how do you like the Supra pumps? i know the bosch pumps are noisey but i know they work well..
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Old Apr 14, 2011 | 10:36 AM
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I am running 4/1600cc RC Engineering injectors with no drivability issues.
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Old Apr 14, 2011 | 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Rotary Buddha
Onto the spare issue what some people do in PR is insane enough. A good portion of the braking of the car comes from your tire. Even if it is a streebike tire. The amount of contact surface is minuscule, preventing you from driving the 2nd gen at its full potential. But if you want to drive in a death trap cause its cool then by all means go right ahead.
I drove my car with the stock wheel and tire up front. The car had alot of wandering issues with the bias ply out back. Since the change the car is more stable and controllable. I have no braking issues as I drive the speed limit on the street. I always have to take in consideration the smaller tire size when driving as well.
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Old Apr 19, 2011 | 03:28 AM
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If the car isnt running (key in the on position) I can hear it, but I don't notice it at all when driving or during idle. I also have mine rewired.



Also I jumped out the resistor pack to ensure a 12v would be constantly sent to the relay. The resistor pack can lower the voltage down to 9volt and this would not be enough to close the added bosch relay.
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Originally Posted by rotarykidd
you have no idea how many TR members id kill to have this car for just a day...

Last edited by Rotary Buddha; Apr 19, 2011 at 03:30 AM.
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