Rear Suspension
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Joined: Aug 2001
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Originally posted by Force Fed 23
One thing I've never understood is how stock length control arms can improve traction so much. I don't doubt for a second that the stock arms flex, I just can't see how boxing them or getting stronger stock length arms can help as much as a set of Southsides that change the instant center.
One thing I've never understood is how stock length control arms can improve traction so much. I don't doubt for a second that the stock arms flex, I just can't see how boxing them or getting stronger stock length arms can help as much as a set of Southsides that change the instant center.
If you were talking about the X2C arms, they are not stock length.
http://www.x2cmotorsports.com/cart/s...d=true&key=124
Zate, you need to decide what your goal is for the rear and what kind of budget you have. That will determine what you go with.
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Do you own a Torch Red FRC and tremble every time you drive under I75 on Hwy 60 and look in your rearview mirror? If so you are suffering from what is known as Cobraphobia.
"I'm in the 82nd Airborne and this is as far as the bastards are going!"
93 Cobra, R302 331,canfields,T-76,TKO......sold
87 Coupe, 466, Edelbrock heads,Vic jr,150 shot 10.41@129.5...sold
2006 Honda 450ER .....new toy
Do you own a Torch Red FRC and tremble every time you drive under I75 on Hwy 60 and look in your rearview mirror? If so you are suffering from what is known as Cobraphobia.
357 monster
Joined: Aug 2003
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Originally posted by Zate
i had some other stuff come up and couldnt afford the timenor money to do the IRS swap..
thinking of adjustable uppers and lowers.. and a swaybar right now..
oh and some springs.. but not sure what ones.. i basically want to improve the overall handling.. both on the drag strip.. and around the street.. certainyl dont want it to take corners any worse than it does now.. better if possible..
i had some other stuff come up and couldnt afford the timenor money to do the IRS swap..
thinking of adjustable uppers and lowers.. and a swaybar right now..
oh and some springs.. but not sure what ones.. i basically want to improve the overall handling.. both on the drag strip.. and around the street.. certainyl dont want it to take corners any worse than it does now.. better if possible..
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I think Zate really needs to decide on what hes going to do with the car first 
Id just order some kit from MM or steeda and be done with it. Amrs, springs and swaybars are the easier and cheaper things to do. After that its torque arm and panhard bar
Id just order some kit from MM or steeda and be done with it. Amrs, springs and swaybars are the easier and cheaper things to do. After that its torque arm and panhard bar
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TR Balla Donor Supreme
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i guess I am confused a little.. Torque armand panhard bar means removing the upper control arms ?
Also.. is it really that cut and dry?.. if i make changes to improve traction my turning will suffer?.. and vice versa ?
Also.. is it really that cut and dry?.. if i make changes to improve traction my turning will suffer?.. and vice versa ?
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Camaros come with torque arms and panhard bars from the factory, they seem to turn quite well 
Yea, you will be removing the uppers yes, and some kits you will need to dumps on the exhaust or side exit
Yea, you will be removing the uppers yes, and some kits you will need to dumps on the exhaust or side exit
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"I am and what I do are not a taxable commodity for you to use and abuse" - Me
This is my fuck the government movement
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OUCH!!!
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Ok, here goes my explanation of the uppers and lowers.
The lower control arms are mounted perpendicular(90*) to the axle.
The uppers are mounted about 20* (ballpark guess) off of perpendicular (so 110* and 70*).
The upper arms control where the axle goes during vertical movement that they also keep the axle centered under the car.
One of the biggest problems with the 4 link is bind. This happens because you have control arms (uppers and lowers) of different lengths affixed to the axle moving in different arcs as the axle moves up and down relative to the vehicle. The arcs cross at a point and are 'fairly' close to one another, but as you move further up (or down for that matter), the arcs deviate more. This causes bushing deflection and eventually bind (as the bushings run out of room to compress).
The bushing deflection and bind actually provide dampening (spring rate) in a very unpredictable manner and make the 4 link very difficult to dial in.
A panhard bar is designed to locate the axle under the car in a centered fashion as well, so when you put one in, you no longer need the uppers to locate the axle in that plane and can take them out entirely. The panhard bar has different geometry and mounts to the chassis in alternate locations and doesn't cause bind that the stock uppers do.
The torque arm controlls body roll. It's a steel bar that runs parallel to the driveshaft with brackets on each end. The front brackes mount to the tranny mounts (so the front of the bar is fixed). The rear brackes mount to the axle. The end result is that when the car rolls, the bar twists (tortion).
Hopefully that explains things for you a little bit zate.
The lower control arms are mounted perpendicular(90*) to the axle.
The uppers are mounted about 20* (ballpark guess) off of perpendicular (so 110* and 70*).
The upper arms control where the axle goes during vertical movement that they also keep the axle centered under the car.
One of the biggest problems with the 4 link is bind. This happens because you have control arms (uppers and lowers) of different lengths affixed to the axle moving in different arcs as the axle moves up and down relative to the vehicle. The arcs cross at a point and are 'fairly' close to one another, but as you move further up (or down for that matter), the arcs deviate more. This causes bushing deflection and eventually bind (as the bushings run out of room to compress).
The bushing deflection and bind actually provide dampening (spring rate) in a very unpredictable manner and make the 4 link very difficult to dial in.
A panhard bar is designed to locate the axle under the car in a centered fashion as well, so when you put one in, you no longer need the uppers to locate the axle in that plane and can take them out entirely. The panhard bar has different geometry and mounts to the chassis in alternate locations and doesn't cause bind that the stock uppers do.
The torque arm controlls body roll. It's a steel bar that runs parallel to the driveshaft with brackets on each end. The front brackes mount to the tranny mounts (so the front of the bar is fixed). The rear brackes mount to the axle. The end result is that when the car rolls, the bar twists (tortion).
Hopefully that explains things for you a little bit zate.
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TR Balla Donor Supreme
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oies.. so i guess i need to rethink this stuff.
I want to cut time off my 60ft and make it stick better on the 1/4 .. but i dont want it to suffer on the street which is where i do 99% of my driving.. I'd like to increase both my "off the line" and cornering traction.
I want to cut time off my 60ft and make it stick better on the 1/4 .. but i dont want it to suffer on the street which is where i do 99% of my driving.. I'd like to increase both my "off the line" and cornering traction.
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Mullet Powered
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www.maximummotorsports.com has so really good deals on suspension packages ranging from upper and lowers to a whole drag race suspension
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