thanks guys, i have some rota lookalikes,(traded for my stock si rims) they look somewhat like them, there five spoke 14'' rims and there painted black so i wanted to change it around a bit...ill take before and after pics, ill re-post cause i dont have a camera and i dont know how long it will take to get pics. bit if someone can leyt me knwo what these rims are from i'd apprecieate it - post soon -thanks-