Screw new school amps!
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Screw new school amps!
For those of you who read my last post...
https://www.tamparacing.com/forums/a...ing-think.html
Well, I sure as hell DID do the right thing.
All I can say is HOLY F*CK!!!
Granted I went from about 900W to 1200W of bass with the change too, but they also say it takes a power increase of 10 to make a perceived loudness increase of double..
I wont say it sounds twice as loud, but this system hasnt made my ears hurt deep down inside since I had a custom bandpass enlcosure. Right now its just in a ported box to manufacturers specs...
I need to add a battery(or two). I have a 1F cap, but the lights go WAY dim. I think the guy in front of me thought I was flashing him.
So out with the late model Rockford, in with the old school PPI Arts...
https://www.tamparacing.com/forums/a...ing-think.html
Well, I sure as hell DID do the right thing.
All I can say is HOLY F*CK!!!
Granted I went from about 900W to 1200W of bass with the change too, but they also say it takes a power increase of 10 to make a perceived loudness increase of double..
I wont say it sounds twice as loud, but this system hasnt made my ears hurt deep down inside since I had a custom bandpass enlcosure. Right now its just in a ported box to manufacturers specs...
I need to add a battery(or two). I have a 1F cap, but the lights go WAY dim. I think the guy in front of me thought I was flashing him.
So out with the late model Rockford, in with the old school PPI Arts...
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Comparing a PPI Art to a newer RF is like comparing a Mercedes to a Honda. Glad to hear you like it....bring it to the meet now to see what you're hitting.
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isuck
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Im curious as to why you say they do nothing. Not that I am saying you are wrong, but if its common knowledge that a 1F cap doesnt do crap, that information hasnt filtered down to the people who dont LIVE car audio.
And if the above IS true, then it just proves that experts dont know what the fuck they are talking about I guess. Since the EARLY 90s, I used to run extra batteries on a big power install.
I had an Orion 2250SX at the time. Orion recommended 2 batteries per 2250 in addition to the cars battery. They recommended atleast one extra battery. At that time caps were starting to gain momentum. I asked the guy at Orion about using caps, and he laughed, and said 'nope, they dont do anything, just do extra batteries'.....
At the time, sounded good to me, but over a very short course of time Orion seemed to be the only one saying such a thing. Rule of thumb was 1F per 1000W. It WAS the rule. Car Audio and Electronics(which used to be more than just a showcase) had articles saying so, amp manufacturers were saying so, the shops were saying so. Then I bought another 2250 a couple of years back and when I called Orion even THEY changed their tune too... Just put a farad cap on it they said.
So if all the 'dumb people' are thinking farad caps do something, its because all the 'smart people' said for the past 15 years that they did.
Totally overkill, but Im going to rewire the power distribution with 1/0 from the front battery. Im going to put in either one or two extra batteries in the bed, havent decided yet. But I also want to either redo the sub enclosure(may go back to a bandpass) or simply change out for a pair of 15s. Doing the bandpass means getting some mid bases that can keep up, which also means building an enclosure to fit them and installing another amp to run them. I am running out of space because for the most part, because everything is situated where you can't see it and I want to keep it that way. Also, I need a larger amp for mids and highs and probably new speakers for them too.
And if the above IS true, then it just proves that experts dont know what the fuck they are talking about I guess. Since the EARLY 90s, I used to run extra batteries on a big power install.
I had an Orion 2250SX at the time. Orion recommended 2 batteries per 2250 in addition to the cars battery. They recommended atleast one extra battery. At that time caps were starting to gain momentum. I asked the guy at Orion about using caps, and he laughed, and said 'nope, they dont do anything, just do extra batteries'.....
At the time, sounded good to me, but over a very short course of time Orion seemed to be the only one saying such a thing. Rule of thumb was 1F per 1000W. It WAS the rule. Car Audio and Electronics(which used to be more than just a showcase) had articles saying so, amp manufacturers were saying so, the shops were saying so. Then I bought another 2250 a couple of years back and when I called Orion even THEY changed their tune too... Just put a farad cap on it they said.
So if all the 'dumb people' are thinking farad caps do something, its because all the 'smart people' said for the past 15 years that they did.
Totally overkill, but Im going to rewire the power distribution with 1/0 from the front battery. Im going to put in either one or two extra batteries in the bed, havent decided yet. But I also want to either redo the sub enclosure(may go back to a bandpass) or simply change out for a pair of 15s. Doing the bandpass means getting some mid bases that can keep up, which also means building an enclosure to fit them and installing another amp to run them. I am running out of space because for the most part, because everything is situated where you can't see it and I want to keep it that way. Also, I need a larger amp for mids and highs and probably new speakers for them too.
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Heck, i think the older 360aII hit just as good as the 500S.. Fading from side to side was hardly a difference.
Not sure about the meet. I didnt go out of the way to make the install look horrible, but I didnt put a whole lot into it. And the truck is just my beater. I never even covered the box where you see it in the bed because Im always hauling stuff which would just ruin it. Theres a small block Ford engine rolling around in the back right now. The box is covered in dirt, grease, and Im suprised that something hasnt slid through it and punched a big hole in it by now..LOL..
It's a wooden pickle.
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1 farad caps aren't useless per se, just not terribly useful. they'll even out the voltage on really low power systems (500 watts at most, and not for long either... maybe half a second of actual power, probably less), but i can't imagine they'll do you much good if you start cranking it up for extended amounts of time listening to 36 mafia.
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Last edited by Miles; Jul 29, 2006 at 08:19 AM.
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1 farad caps aren't useless per se, just not terribly useful. they'll even out the voltage on really low power systems (500 watts at most, and not for long either... maybe half a second of actual power, probably less), but i can't imagine they'll do you much good if you start cranking it up for extended amounts of time listening to 36 mafia.
Theres a thread where I did the math - I beleive its about 250 ms for a 1 farad capacitor with an 80% tolerance and a 60amp peak.
The reason they are usefull is not for enduring long bass notes - but for punchy bass such as double bass notes. I'll break it down really simple:
The power wire itself presents a voltage drop and a time delay or about a 1/30th of a second from demand to supply AND a lead acid battery presents a supply delay of nearly 1/10th of a second for a 50 amp draw!
That means that for a fraction of a second there is NO increase in current. That means there is NO increase in power to the amp which results in a massive voltage drop - to around 9 to 10 volts from 14volts.
A capacitor's measly 1/4th of a second of maintained power is more than enough to cove the supply delay and since the battery has no problem maintaining that current spike for a few extra milliseconds while the capacitor recharges, it causes no loss in power.
In order to understand the value of a capacitor you have to understand how short a bass punch really is - maybe a half a second at most. So half of that note isnt getting full potential from your amplifier every time the bass hits.
Capacitor = HIGHER PEAK POWER
BIG THREE = HIGHER MAINTAINED POWER
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Not sure about the meet. I didnt go out of the way to make the install look horrible, but I didnt put a whole lot into it. And the truck is just my beater. I never even covered the box where you see it in the bed because Im always hauling stuff which would just ruin it. Theres a small block Ford engine rolling around in the back right now. The box is covered in dirt, grease, and Im suprised that something hasnt slid through it and punched a big hole in it by now..LOL..
Doesn't really matter how it looks or if you even have a system at all. I'm not saying to go and show it off like it's the next best thing to sliced bread...but atleast go and see what kind of numbers you're hitting for yourself, heck it's free.
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I got a dig bick. You this read wrong. You read that wrong too.
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Ahhh the old Orion 2250sx...I had number 3 off the production line, back in the day. That brings back some memories. And people say power is too expensive today...
oh, and 1 farad caps...its like a finer mesh screen on the door to the submarine...better, but still almost useless.
Toby
oh, and 1 farad caps...its like a finer mesh screen on the door to the submarine...better, but still almost useless.
Toby
