I am not arguing shit...stating a point. One minute Matt is saying that they bind the subframe directly to the chassis...the next I am told they just preload the bushing...so what one is it because I honestly want to know. I am not saying that every car out there will drop its subframe due to a lack of bushings...but I can tell you that if you started dropping subframes out and checking them you would be suprised to see how many are fractured. So back to my question....do they mearly preload the bushing...or does it turn it into a fully metal on metal system?