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Old Apr 5, 2009 | 03:43 PM
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kapone
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Originally Posted by fastforward
I can't cite the Prowler and Viper? Then the Japanese Car Fans can't site the Skyline GTR and Honda Civic Si as innovative products.

both the civic si and skyline gtr's were separate models of an overall production vehicle unlike the prowler and viper...

Chrysler has built plenty of good vehicles in the last 20 years many of which were leaders in innovation:

1. The cab-forward movement was pioneered by Chrysler. Its a design strategy that shifted the passenger compartment forward and spread the wheels outward creating a more aerodynamic albeit unpopular shape today. Nevertheless still innovative in that it shed the notion of how a car had to be packaged.

ill give you cab forward ....

2. The introduction of the Neon SRT-4 heralded a new horsepower war. Dodge generated huge amounts of power out of the Neon's powerplant yet still maintained its civility. In a time when the Civic Si's 160HP seemed like a lot the SRT-4's 230HP was a major improvement. This upp'd the ante, and you can thank Dodge that today our sport compacts come with more guts.

Your forgetting that the srt4 was an answer to the wrx and evo not the civic. Both which had awd and were far techno superior unfortunatelly dodge fell behind on that one too ...

3.) I'm going to cite it anyway....the Viper. Besides its obvious reasons, the Viper started as a concept with no promise of being produced. But Dodge did a 180 and in less than one year it was a production model. At a time when car makers took 3-5 years to develop a car, Dodge did it in 1 year. Since that time, car makers have shaved years off development using the same strategies Dodge pioneered in 1989.

The reason they were able to relese it so quick was because all the parts were from another vehicle, from the wheel hubs being from the ram to give a small example. No real inovasion there. As the later model came out RnD came very prevalent thats why there is such a drastic difference from the first model to the last in the same production model...

4. The dodge truck. The full size Ram proved that a truck didn't have to be just utilitarian, but that it could be nice to look at and civil. Add to that the Dakota was way ahead of its time, as a mid-size truck. Something Nissan tries to take credit for with the Frontier

ill give you the mid size thing but the interiors of those dakotas were extremly generic and work truck like. (I should know I worked at a dodge dealership in 98-99)

5. The sport compact car/hatch. Yes, thats right. You can give dodge the credit. Sure a bit later than 20 years ago when it all started. But the innovative Shelby Chargers and GLHS's were light years ahead of the Japanese when it comes to real performance in a budget package. In fact today, those 20 year old Shelbys would lay waste to some modern "performance" imports.

I said 20 not 30 years ago. Both those cars were mid to late 80s cars if dodge wouldn't have went away from that the F&F might have had a bunch of riced out dodges instead of hondas ...

6. V-10. Today a common site on any construction site. Dodge was the first to offer an oversized powerplant for oversized work loads.

I would have to think that all the big 3 had over size work trucks. maybe dodge beat them by a year or 2 but I can hardly call that innovation...

7. Making retro cool. When most car companies were making jelly beans with wheels. Chrysler/Dodge started making cars that had some appeal.
The Prowler and even the lowly PT Cruiser paid homage to yesterday's hot rods.
Rising from the dead, the Charger and Challenger offer everyone a chance at reliving the musclecar era all over again. When car companies try to make a car for everyone. Dodge has never been afraid of making a car for specific enthusiasts.

I agree with the bringing the retro back but it was 10 years too late. lets bring back v8 sedans and the hemi when gas prices starting going up. Dodges line up in the 90s when gas was durt cheep was shit (neon, avenger, sebring, breez, caravan) all fwd underpowered econo shit boxes.

8. The PT Cruiser. Love it or hate it (okay Hate it) you have to recognize that it ushered in an era of personal, economical, and affordable mini transport. Like a shruken mini-van it was the first of a wave of small transporters that hit the American shore. Scion Xb anyone? Do you really think we would have seen so many little boxes on wheels had Chrysler not sold a shit ton of PTs? (Plus a turbo PT will kill a Xb....and they are both fugly)

The japs started the small box car movement a couple years before dodge they just didn't bring it hear cause it wasn't in demand yet. Why do you think it was so quick for the japs to introduce the (xb, nissan cube, versa, honda element) they were already in production in the home land ...

9. The mini-van. Yes it came about a little over 20 years ago. Today Chrysler still manages to make the right van for the right price. The Odyssey is a nice vehicle, but priced like a luxury car, so it better be nicer.
New yearly innovations on the Caravan keep everyone else trying to keep in step.

The mini van segment is the only thing they did right and stayed ahead of the curve...

10. Jeep and Marketing. They saved Jeep. An American institution. The original off road vehicle for the mass public. Yes, there are better off road vehicles that can take you to places you'll never end up going in real life. But at what price?
The Jeep (aside from the dismal Compass) has always delivered what's promised at an affordable price. But the real innovation here is the marketing. Its more than a car its a lifestyle brand. Chrysler has done a good job of selling the "feel" of owning a Jeep to the world. Including a magazine, and clothing line. Something only wish they could do as well. You probably won't find more die-hard fans than Jeep fans. Its more of a cult and less of a owners group. Plus the Cherokee SRT-8 is just superb.

The name was already there and history also they just made it profitable by stream lining it and advertising more ... by the way the Cherokees of the 90 were to small inside for what they were, and the grand Cherokees were severely underpowered an I6 with only like 220 hp to push a 4000+ truck ... again hardly innovative...

11. SRT. The marque's high performance division can make even the most benign car a fire breathing monster. If any one of the SRT-8 cars were Japanese cars, there'd be SO MANY nutswingers on this message board it would clog the server.

Toyota has TRD, Subaru has STI, Honda has mugen and spoon (all though they are an independent shop that works closely with them) Nissan has nismo, Ford has SVT, and cosworth (see spoon description above) and so on... so SRT is nothing new or innovative.....

I could probably keep going, but its fruitless. There are just too many people out there that are too close minded to realize that when it comes to quality and innovation....the Japanese do not have the market cornered. Yes, the big 3 have had some hard times, but this is the same big 3 that pulled through the great depression and WWII. If people would get their heads our of their collective asses and walk into a Big 3 dealership they might realize that there is a whole new world of cool cars and trucks out there.
Actually its funny you say close minded... I love all cars. All my teenage friends drove and modified Chevy's and that's what I learned my mechanic skill on for a while till I started with Toyota and then worked my way to Honda eventually. (the car in my sig is my first Honda) After the first Chrysler bail out in the early 80s they did innovate for about 8 yeas and then in the 90s they fell off again with quality and designs, and now its biting them in the ass. As stated above they were about 8-10 years late on the v8/hemi movement. Hell I still saw the redneck "Hemi" commercials when gas was $4.10 a gallon and not a single Caliber commercial on tv during the nfl season. They were behind the times unfortunately and still could not get a clue ...
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Last edited by kapone; Apr 5, 2009 at 03:47 PM.
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