lol well to each his own,i know from my experince with the whole scene which may not be as much as others.ive seen my friend take a used "stock" crx and hang with a wrx,ive seen barely modded civics beat mustangs who "suppose" to be a v6.throw a type r engine"stock" into a hatch and it will eat stock v6 stangs like its out of style.same hp even tho the "R" has way less tq.and its just not hondas but other imports.so to say no matter what a domestic will win is not correct,seen a hooked up hatch beat a viper.not by much but still,yea most of the time a domestic will win but not all the time.