420A question !

redlatinapearl · 01-03-2007, 09:37 PM

I have a 420A motor im trynna turbo it but my biggest problem is detonation does anyone know if I would have to retard timing and how would i do so... any information that would make this transition as smooth as possible would help alot........

Ahhhh Nick! · 01-03-2007, 10:42 PM

Are you turboing a 1st gen neon (95-99)? Shouldn't have to adjust timing for boost unless it's alot of boost. I'm running a bone stock engine and a turbo with no problems.

Brandon · 01-07-2007, 02:51 PM

post this up in mitsubishi tech, you'll get a lot more answers. I'm not sure if you're aware but that motor was in the NA eclipses. There are a lot of guys over there that have experience and know how when it comes to those motors. Just giving you an extra option.

--brandon

Josiah · 01-09-2007, 09:14 PM

if you have the DOHC neon engine then it is not a 420A...but is the same for the pourposes of turbocharging...as far as detonation goes, you are first off sure it is detonation correct? how did you come to this conclusion...detonation is generally not a problem unless you are running high boost, as for retarding the timing, forget it, you cant really touch it, the computer controls it, and short of a $300 ignition box, theres not much you can do about it, and if you spend $300 you might as well buy a MegaSquirt, but I for one doubt detonation is your problem, since there are a lot of people running high boost on the stock computer, more likely your issue is fuel, and/or MAP sensor cutout

Brandon · 01-09-2007, 10:36 PM

the 420A is a dual cam..and it did come in neons. how is he suppose to know the difference?

**FLNeonRT** · 01-11-2007, 07:18 AM

There were differences such as most, if not, all DOHCs that came in Neons had combined intake air temp. and MAP sensors where the DOHC used in the Eclipse had seperate sensors to do each function. This is why the Missing Link for the 420A cannot be used on a Neon DOHC engine.

Ignition timing with a stock ECU isn't really a problem either as it works pretty well to a point even with a turbocharger.

I'd be more inclined to believe its a fuel issue as stated. Either your injectors are too small or sticking or your rate of gain is not high enough and your leaning out.

Other then melting plugs or knowing how to read them, I'd like to know how you came to the conclusion it was detonation. What do the AFRs look like in boost? Are you going above 13:1 at any point in time? Without a wideband or something to monitor the AFR, there isn't much a untrained eye or ear is gonna pick up.

Josiah · 01-12-2007, 07:35 PM

well actually the exception to the sensors Mike mentioned is the 95 DOHC neon which has a seperate IAT and MAP sensors....but he is right, as for the 420A coming in neons, it NEVER came in ANY neon, it did come in Avengers...but do not make the mistake of believing that the 420A engine is the same as the DOHC neon engine(which by the way is a D4RE, while the SOHC engine is a S4RE) the block on the 420A and the D4RE are the same, but the head is reversed, and the 420A uses weaker camshafts, and has in general different wiring and harnesses....but thats all beside the point and off topic, try to find out like FLneonRT said your AFRs throughout your boost range and if you can, your map sensor voltages as well to figure out whats going on

jdub24 · 01-29-2008, 12:21 PM

how would i get 3 to 400 hp when i rebuild my 420a

**FLNeonRT** · 02-04-2008, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdub24

how would i get 3 to 400 hp when i rebuild my 420a

Nitrous or turbo, both will require a full build and deep pockets. To elaborate and further than that would be pointless because reaching for that goal usually means you already have a build plan and are capable of proper installation or are willing to pay for proper installation (not to mention assembly and tuning).

**.Seth.** · 02-11-2008, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brandon

the 420A is a dual cam..and it did come in neons. how is he suppose to know the difference?

they arent the same look ^ to see the differences

Sippi · 03-01-2008, 08:17 AM

From wat i have heard 420's aren't very reliable at all. A guy I knew from around had one that is identical to tha one in FLneonRT's sig. But from wat other people told me he had tons of problems with his setup and motor! 420's are not reliable motors IMO if u can afford it go with the 2.4 that is in the SRT_4

**.Seth.** · 03-01-2008, 11:05 AM

^not always... you have to do a 2.0 right tho, u cant just slap parts on it

and the 2.4 is harder b/c its already turbo so u dont have to mess w/ 3/4 the stuff u do w/ a 2.0

01-03-2007, 09:37 PM	#1 (permalink)
redlatinapearl Registered User Car: My TRGarage : 318	420A question ! I have a 420A motor im trynna turbo it but my biggest problem is detonation does anyone know if I would have to retard timing and how would i do so... any information that would make this transition as smooth as possible would help alot........

01-03-2007, 10:42 PM	#2 (permalink)
Ahhhh Nick! Out Of Towner Car: A couple Neons. My TRGarage Summerville, SC : 649782161	Are you turboing a 1st gen neon (95-99)? Shouldn't have to adjust timing for boost unless it's alot of boost. I'm running a bone stock engine and a turbo with no problems.

01-07-2007, 02:51 PM	#3 (permalink)
Brandon pasn u sdwyz n the slo ln Car: My TRGarage Virginia : 2147483647	post this up in mitsubishi tech, you'll get a lot more answers. I'm not sure if you're aware but that motor was in the NA eclipses. There are a lot of guys over there that have experience and know how when it comes to those motors. Just giving you an extra option. --brandon

01-09-2007, 09:14 PM	#4 (permalink)
Josiah Peon on steroids! Car: 97 Dodge neon coupe(built SRT engine when I have the time) '66 mustang coupe(restomod project) My TRGarage Franklin, TN : 100	if you have the DOHC neon engine then it is not a 420A...but is the same for the pourposes of turbocharging...as far as detonation goes, you are first off sure it is detonation correct? how did you come to this conclusion...detonation is generally not a problem unless you are running high boost, as for retarding the timing, forget it, you cant really touch it, the computer controls it, and short of a $300 ignition box, theres not much you can do about it, and if you spend $300 you might as well buy a MegaSquirt, but I for one doubt detonation is your problem, since there are a lot of people running high boost on the stock computer, more likely your issue is fuel, and/or MAP sensor cutout

01-09-2007, 10:36 PM	#5 (permalink)
Brandon pasn u sdwyz n the slo ln Car: My TRGarage Virginia : 2147483647	the 420A is a dual cam..and it did come in neons. how is he suppose to know the difference?

01-11-2007, 07:18 AM	#6 (permalink)
FLNeonRT BOOSTEDNATION.ORG Car: 1999 Dodge Neon R/T-T Stage ? My TRGarage Largo, FL. : 2251126	There were differences such as most, if not, all DOHCs that came in Neons had combined intake air temp. and MAP sensors where the DOHC used in the Eclipse had seperate sensors to do each function. This is why the Missing Link for the 420A cannot be used on a Neon DOHC engine. Ignition timing with a stock ECU isn't really a problem either as it works pretty well to a point even with a turbocharger. I'd be more inclined to believe its a fuel issue as stated. Either your injectors are too small or sticking or your rate of gain is not high enough and your leaning out. Other then melting plugs or knowing how to read them, I'd like to know how you came to the conclusion it was detonation. What do the AFRs look like in boost? Are you going above 13:1 at any point in time? Without a wideband or something to monitor the AFR, there isn't much a untrained eye or ear is gonna pick up.

01-12-2007, 07:35 PM	#7 (permalink)
Josiah Peon on steroids! Car: 97 Dodge neon coupe(built SRT engine when I have the time) '66 mustang coupe(restomod project) My TRGarage Franklin, TN : 100	well actually the exception to the sensors Mike mentioned is the 95 DOHC neon which has a seperate IAT and MAP sensors....but he is right, as for the 420A coming in neons, it NEVER came in ANY neon, it did come in Avengers...but do not make the mistake of believing that the 420A engine is the same as the DOHC neon engine(which by the way is a D4RE, while the SOHC engine is a S4RE) the block on the 420A and the D4RE are the same, but the head is reversed, and the 420A uses weaker camshafts, and has in general different wiring and harnesses....but thats all beside the point and off topic, try to find out like FLneonRT said your AFRs throughout your boost range and if you can, your map sensor voltages as well to figure out whats going on

01-29-2008, 12:21 PM	#8 (permalink)
jdub24 Registered User Car: My TRGarage : 10	how would i get 3 to 400 hp when i rebuild my 420a

03-01-2008, 08:17 AM	#11 (permalink)
Sippi Ranger on 22's son!!! Car: 08 Ranger My TRGarage Clearwater, FL : 1629120811	From wat i have heard 420's aren't very reliable at all. A guy I knew from around had one that is identical to tha one in FLneonRT's sig. But from wat other people told me he had tons of problems with his setup and motor! 420's are not reliable motors IMO if u can afford it go with the 2.4 that is in the SRT_4

03-01-2008, 11:05 AM	#12 (permalink)
.Seth. TR Balla Donor Supreme Car: My TRGarage Brandon/Chicago/VA : 2147483647	^not always... you have to do a 2.0 right tho, u cant just slap parts on it and the 2.4 is harder b/c its already turbo so u dont have to mess w/ 3/4 the stuff u do w/ a 2.0