Dynomat knock-off installation

[Gorky_Park]

Just got this kit SDM Xtreme Trunk Kit Sound Deadener + Dynamat Sample - eBay (item 330381279318 end time Nov-30-09 06:42:40 PST) that comes with 5 Sheets 18" X 36" 50 Mil Thick. Wondering what strategic surfaces I should apply it to (other than the trunk lid, the trunk floor and the sides).

Another question is do I reinstall the trunk upholstery after the dynamat is in? Like all the carpeting on the sites etc.

and finally, do you put dynamat under the spare? I keep seeing pictures of that area covered but want to double check...

Thanks for replies!

[Gorky_Park]

42 views and no replies?

[kpr10is]

Everything should reinstall once the dynamat is in, so you shouldn't see it at all, and yes, underneath the spare. Wheel wells are a noisy spot in most cars. What car is it going in?

Not sure if you were planning on doing the doors (although you'd have to buy more) but they're the part I'm a fan of if choosing which parts to do. The benefits are more tangible; the sound you hear every time you shut the door, the road noise decrease, the benefits to your speakers, etc.

[NT_Hardcore]

you got to put it everywhere lol and yes reinstall panels and carpet. should look factory when done

[Gorky_Park]

OK thanks guys

[Kyleisme]

Originally Posted by kpr10is

Everything should reinstall once the dynamat is in, so you shouldn't see it at all, and yes, underneath the spare. Wheel wells are a noisy spot in most cars. What car is it going in?

Not sure if you were planning on doing the doors (although you'd have to buy more) but they're the part I'm a fan of if choosing which parts to do. The benefits are more tangible; the sound you hear every time you shut the door, the road noise decrease, the benefits to your speakers, etc.

this is partly correct.. road noise will hardly decrease from dynamat or its similar competitors.. it will decrease only a tad.. for noise reducing you need a mass loaded vinyl..

as for where/how to apply it.. you don't need full coverage.. people will tell you that you do all day long and its bullshit.. but don't believe me if you want.. layer the hell out of everything and everywhere.. thats what most will tell you.. what you actually need to do is find where the resonance is at its most.. where you actually feel the panel vibrating.. place the pieces there.. trying to use vibration dampener (which it is called if you look closely) as a sound dampener is not only idiotic but costly.. thats not its job.. yes it will do it.. but only as much as someone holding up tinfoil in front of there face and talking behind it to you.. yes it will muffle a little but once again.. not its job..

look at sounddeadenershowdown.com

[MCOR]

Originally Posted by Kyleisme

this is partly correct.. road noise will hardly decrease from dynamat or its similar competitors.. it will decrease only a tad.. for noise reducing you need a mass loaded vinyl..

as for where/how to apply it.. you don't need full coverage.. people will tell you that you do all day long and its bullshit.. but don't believe me if you want.. layer the hell out of everything and everywhere.. thats what most will tell you.. what you actually need to do is find where the resonance is at its most.. where you actually feel the panel vibrating.. place the pieces there.. trying to use vibration dampener (which it is called if you look closely) as a sound dampener is not only idiotic but costly.. thats not its job.. yes it will do it.. but only as much as someone holding up tinfoil in front of there face and talking behind it to you.. yes it will muffle a little but once again.. not its job..

look at sounddeadenershowdown.com

Well, without stirring a poop storm, l'm just going to agree to disagree. I have a perfect example here at the shop at how effective sound deadner really is-as a noise reducer among other things. My general manager Jeff drives a large F250 diesel chipped, exhaust, etc. It has large loud tires on it and it is by no means quiet. However, he stripped the interior a while back except for the dash (crew cab mind you) and installed a combination of Dynamat and Stinger Road Kill on the complete roof, door skins and panels, flooring, firewall, etc. in preparation for a shop display vehicle with a complete JL sound system.

I would challenge anyone to get into his vehicle and tell me that it sounds no different from any other one inside. We work on lots of trucks of this type out here and we like to demo his truck to other diesel owners without telling them about what has been done. EVERY customer that hears his truck comments on how different it sounds from theirs. When the sound system does come on is when it really shines. Many members here have heard his truck and I would believe them to agree.

I know about this site you referred to and there is quite a bit of debate about it in other private professional industry forums. I would say that many of the worlds top professionals and manufacturers very much preach about the importance of at least one layer of dampner everywhere inside the vehicle (as you well know). Does that mean it is right? Of course not. But, one of my favorite sales is when I have a customer whom we have built systems for over the years that may have never seen the importance of using it completely. Then, for one reason or another decide to spend the bucks to have it done. Their response is always like a light clicking on in their head when it is done-they finally get it. The two things customers ALWAYS comment on after a job like this is done is how much "different" the system sounds, and how much quieter and tighter the car sounds/feels.

I understand all the theories and testing but from having witnessed many systems over the years especially with befores and afters, it really makes a difference.

Again, just my opinion...

[the727kid]

Both of you have valid arguments. End of story it begins with the car you have. Obviously if you have 2010 Lexus, doing 2 layers across the car is going to be barley noticable, but if you have a 67 Chevelle, it will be night and day. (Kind of drastic examples, but they help my point).

I am willing to bet 2 layers across my car would not make that much of an audible difference except on the doors.

[Kyleisme]

Mcor, how much deadener was used on the ford? I bet a good amount. Secondly, I never said it DOESN'T work.. I said thats not its intentions.. It will do the job obviously as it puts a barrier between you and the noise but its not made for that.. And I know you and anyone who sells deadener would love people to believe the pile it up method as its money in the pocket.. Hell anthony got called out for it and changed his ways.. A LITTLE.. still won't say it up front unless asked.. I am in no way comparing you two as I would hope you would be a little more honest than that or atleast say thats what the manufacturing recommends rather then blatantly say yes pile it up will do the job the best..

727kid hit another nail on the head as well with how much you need it will help more.. when some is there not a huge difference.. none is there.. huge difference..

also.. people want to believe what they spent their money works.. so the placebo is already there.. unless skeptical from the start they will believe it worked wonders..

Rudy at Sounddeadenershowdown.com will tell you straight up. I will believe someone willing to send you else where when he can't do it or do it as cheap over someone that doesn't want to tell you until someone spills the beans and you press the issue..

[luke81]

sounddeadenershowdown.com is total crap, that goon got "test samples" from a number of companies on the premise of a true test then used those samples to develop his own product. And his 25% coverage bull is just that, bull. Maybe if we were all just sticking it to flat metal tiles of a certain size, shape, thickness and grade hanging from strings that may apply. Especially if we got to choose the exact tile that would work with our silly theory. But since we're dealing with the real world (where he obviously doesn't live) he's clueless. Ripoff artist is what he is. He's been "testing" for 4 years, I've been actually putting the stuff in real cars for 3 times longer than that. He's a bum.

That being said, i agree with some of each post. The biggest thing is like 727 said, the car itself. Some cars have so little OEM deadening that even 1 layer can help, other cars may have zero difference with 3 or 4 layers. On most newer, well built cars I go after what's making the noise instead of just covering the whole car in it. I think that's a more effective use of people's money. But on a vehicle that has a lot of outside noise like MCOR's example there is definite benefits to full coverage.
The biggest thing with any deadener is using it as it's needed, and where it's needed. And don't make things worse in the process. More than once I've seen people layer it too thick in the wrong place, and then the panels wont snap back on and just kind of hover where they are supposed to be. Then they wonder why it's buzzing more than before they did it!

[kpr10is]

I'm not going to get in the argument. The only thing I want to add to that is that my Maxima has about as much factory sound suppression as the aforementioned 67 chevelle.

[Gorky_Park]

it's on 07 camry just want to get rid of rear deck rattle...the plastic piece that covers the speakers...SP makes it go crazy. Thanks for all the responses guys.

[Kyleisme]

Originally Posted by luke81

sounddeadenershowdown.com is total crap, that goon got "test samples" from a number of companies on the premise of a true test then used those samples to develop his own product. And his 25% coverage bull is just that, bull. Maybe if we were all just sticking it to flat metal tiles of a certain size, shape, thickness and grade hanging from strings that may apply. Especially if we got to choose the exact tile that would work with our silly theory. But since we're dealing with the real world (where he obviously doesn't live) he's clueless. Ripoff artist is what he is. He's been "testing" for 4 years, I've been actually putting the stuff in real cars for 3 times longer than that. He's a bum.

That being said, i agree with some of each post. The biggest thing is like 727 said, the car itself. Some cars have so little OEM deadening that even 1 layer can help, other cars may have zero difference with 3 or 4 layers. On most newer, well built cars I go after what's making the noise instead of just covering the whole car in it. I think that's a more effective use of people's money. But on a vehicle that has a lot of outside noise like MCOR's example there is definite benefits to full coverage.
The biggest thing with any deadener is using it as it's needed, and where it's needed. And don't make things worse in the process. More than once I've seen people layer it too thick in the wrong place, and then the panels wont snap back on and just kind of hover where they are supposed to be. Then they wonder why it's buzzing more than before they did it!

If you never saw he did do tests. He then went of that and made his own products that were nothing like that he tested... Now SS came out with SPLTILES to cope with that. And the vibrations may go away along with some noise but to do it right you need other materials.. The tiles/mat/deadner is to reduce panel vibration.. for that you don't need to LAYER up.. I still Never said layering won't work.. Its just the EXPENSIVE way.. Have you ever done a 25% with deadener followed by mass loaded vinyl? if not then you can't say he is a crock..

[Kyleisme]

Originally Posted by Gorky_Park

it's on 07 camry just want to get rid of rear deck rattle...the plastic piece that covers the speakers...SP makes it go crazy. Thanks for all the responses guys.

if its a plastic piece thats rattling against metal a deadener isn't what you need/want.. you want a buffer between the panels.. Foam will help

[luke81]

Sure, he did the tests but it was a sham to later sell his own products. Look at the test on his website with the steel tile, that's a joke. Who owns a car built with steel tiles hung on string? Vehicles are almost totally acoustically coupled - meaning that everything that vibrates is coupled to everything else that vibrates in some way. And in a vehicle you're not trying to silence one instance of vibration from a defined start to a defined end - vibration is a constantly occurring problem in a vehicle. If the object of damping a vehicle was to silence one uncoupled vibration 1 time, it would be simple.

Yeah, i have done his method. When it first came out it was everywhere on all the forums, and more than one person came into the shop i worked at and asked for it. And sometimes it even works, depending totally on the vehicle. Covering 25% of the roof of a dodge magnum with 3 15's works much, much worse than covering 25% of the roof of a reg cab Dakota with a single 10.

It's not as if this guy invented using foam to silence panels rattling against each other....we were doing that in 1999 and before too. I'm not saying nothing on his website is true....I'm saying he didn't invent any of it, his tests are misleading, and some of it simply isn't true. Much of it is very misleading. For example, he states on the first page that you need an absorption material between 10 and 70 inches thick to do anything. Remove the carpet and headliner from almost any vehicle and you'll notice a HUGE difference, and you've only removed an inch or so of material. He says in that same paragraph that all road noise is low frequency. He's obviously never used an RTA in a vehicle while it was moving, or even running because thats simply not true. Sure, the initial vibrations from the engine/exhaust/tires are lower tone....but he doesn't take into account the acoustic coupling of the vehicle. By the time those vibrations get to the interior many are much higher in frequency and many people find them to be much more annoying. Picture hanging a bell off of a bass drum. Each strike of the bass drum is going to create a primary vibration in the low range, but it's also going to create a secondary vibration due to the acoustic coupling of a high frequency sound from that bell.
To each their own, and if one person prefers his methods then thats cool with me. I personally don't, when I do a sound deadener job i individually tailor the products and installation methods to that customer's car, system, and desires. But I will totally agree on this point: I've seen cars come to me with extensive Roadkill/Dynamat jobs that probably cost a lot of money, and because they were done wrong didnt do a darn thing.