All about the wonderful 2.0l 4 cyl engine!

[FearThe4Doors]

Hello dodge people anything new and exciting going on?

[FearThe4Doors]

Yeah im up in New Jersey for the week. Thanks for asking!

[FearThe4Doors]

Wow cool!! What are you doing up there?

[FearThe4Doors]

Im visiting a long time friend who lives here

[FearThe4Doors]

Thats neat. Ive been up to NJ once before myself too

[FearThe4Doors]

so have I actually. Definatly different from back home in Seminole

[FearThe4Doors]

So what are you doing on TR while youre on vacation???

[FearThe4Doors]

Fuckin bored out of my mind. No ones home here. My friend had the day off but something came up so she had to work. Her mom is somewhere and her brother is at work. So i have no car and nobody to talk to.

[FearThe4Doors]

Dude thats shitty as all hell.

[FearThe4Doors]

Yeah tell me about it. Ive been watching the Game Show Network all day!!!!

[FearThe4Doors]

Hahahahah!! The $100000 Pyramid PWNS J00!!!

[FearThe4Doors]

that shows cool as hell but I think Win lose or Draw is pretty pwning itself

[FearThe4Doors]

werd! Those old game shows are hillarious!

[FearThe4Doors]

yeah they are. especially the old Family Feuds

[FearThe4Doors]

so how long will you be watching the game show... err... how long will you be in NJ?

[FearThe4Doors]

Ill be here till the 12th but Im going to NY to hang with Joe (GM-RamFuck) for the next weekend

[FearThe4Doors]

lol be careful man ive heard he tries to get guys drunk and then slip it up their crap shoot when they are passed out sleeping

[FearThe4Doors]

LMAO ive heard that too. And trust me ill take precautions

[FearThe4Doors]

good deal. just giving you a heads up

[FearThe4Doors]

i appreciate it. well im gonna go. im still bored outta my mind

[FearThe4Doors]

alright man. i hope someone comes home soon to entertain you.

[FearThe4Doors]

thanks i do too!!

[FearThe4Doors]

well have fun in Jersey!

[FearThe4Doors]

I will man thanks! Tonite and this weekend... its on!

[mpbiv]

WOW you are bored :haha:

No comments from the peanut gallery :)

[FearThe4Doors]

good deal. catch ya later!

[FearThe4Doors]

later on mang

[mpbiv]

I need to have a original sig which sets me apart from everyone else. So what do you think of this banner :haha:

http://plaza.ufl.edu/mpbiv/pics/trsig.jpg

Just kidding I am bored too

[JohnnyPointless]

i like it...and whatre the chances i might 0wn page 2?

[JohnnyPointless]

fuck..not as good as i thought

[dan]

i own page 2 wheeeee


and ur staying with a girl huh jeff? (why do i have a feeling thats the wrong name!?)

put it in da butt! (not joe the girl-unless shes ur sister)

[mpbiv]

I think thats jeff.

[mpbiv]

And so much for being a non conformist :)

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by mpbiv
I need to have a original sig which sets me apart from everyone else. So what do you think of this banner :haha:

http://plaza.ufl.edu/mpbiv/pics/trsig.jpg

Just kidding I am bored too

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by dan
and ur staying with a girl huh jeff? (why do i have a feeling thats the wrong name!?)

Yeah I am. And what are you talking about with the wrong name? Me? Im Jeff yes.

[FearThe4Doors]

I need a damn unique sig for me too.. with my spirit

everyone else has teams.. what can we be? Team was that a.....?

:haha:

[mpbiv]

My banner OWNZ JOO

oops I mean PWNZ JOO!!!!!!!

:bow::bow::bow::bow::bow::bow::bow::bow:

[mpbiv]

Hmmmm I need a one man Team too :haha:

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by mpbiv
My banner OWNZ JOO

oops I mean PWNZ JOO!!!!!!!

:bow::bow::bow::bow::bow::bow::bow::bow:

wrong again... it pwnz j00

the os are zeros.. lol

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by mpbiv
Hmmmm I need a one man Team too :haha:

no im talking about us turbo dodge people...

[mpbiv]

PWNZ J00

PH34R M3

[FearThe4Doors]

:haha::haha::haha::haha::haha::haha::haha::haha::h aha::haha::haha::haha::haha::haha::haha:

Youre crackin me up once again!!

d00d i need to get out of this h0u53!

[mpbiv]

Oh I just figured they meant team because it included their mechanic and since I doubt any of us in here have mechanics it would be one man :)

However since this is for the Mopar tech room then I still have no idea what would be a good name :haha:

(especially if you mean a serious one)

[mpbiv]

Oh what the PHR34K. I still need a †Ú®b0

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by mpbiv
Oh I just figured they meant team because it included their mechanic and since I doubt any of us in here have mechanics it would be one man :)

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by "Someone"

However since this is for the Mopar tech room then I still have no idea what would be a good name :haha:

(especially if you mean a serious one)

no not really for the mopar room.. for us crazyasses with Spirits and K-cars and other ones that will stomp the imports and leave them thinking what the hell was that?!?

[mpbiv]

So then the name would be

Team :wtf: was that

[FearThe4Doors]

WERD!!

:wtf: W45 7h47

[mpbiv]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by fearthe4doors
WERD!!

:wtf: W45 7h47

¥35 ¡ñD33d WERD™

[mpbiv]

Character maps PWNZ J00

[mpbiv]

Ok I think I need to go do something productive now :)

[CrazyMoparGirl]

Well hey If I hadnt had to work today I would have had the same exact conversation with ya oh well Im off to Las Vegas Baby!!! ya you know me and Bob picking up the girls woohoo NOT!!!!! any how be safe man and take care dont forget to kick Joes Azz for me that darn chevy lover cringe

[Iroc Joe]

I fuckin hate chevys douchestick!! My dad gave it to me what do you want?? Some of us dont have good incomes (read: Im a broke ass college student) Im considering a GN though. I know its a GM but you cant talk shit about that car. Its just fuckin awesome all around. Bishes. And no Jeff I swear I dont have any more roofies :rolleyes: muhauhuahahahahahah :D:D:D:D:D

[mpbiv]

GNs arent that bad probably one of the coolest cars Chevy made. My best buds dad has a 87 T-type which is garage kept 30k original miles and really fun to ride in (they havent let me drive it yet but I did get to drive their 302 5spd Ford station wagon its got more hp than a Cobra). It would make a great sleeper cept for so many people race them that it wouldnt be suprising to get beat by a buick regal :)

You wouldnt get the :wtf: was that expression like us Mopar people though :)

[mpbiv]

Vegas is awesome. I went there last summer best vacation I had stayed in a off strip hotel Hyatt Lake Las Vegas. If you have seen that recently made movie called American Sweethearts (boring movie IMHO) with Julia Roberts and Katherine Zeta Jones it was the hotel in the movie.

There is so much stuff out there it takes a few days to see most of it. Enjoy :)

[Iroc Joe]

Its a Buick not a chibby ;)

[mpbiv]

I realize that in fact I said buick later in the post if you see. As far as I am concerned Chevy/GMC/blah blah blah its all the same :)

GM has too many nameplates so I have little regard to differentiate between them all the time.

[leadfootedfool]

oh no

[leadfootedfool]

sees the straight

[leadfootedfool]

punches it hits the nos spools the turbo

[leadfootedfool]

boo ya 22 psi

[leadfootedfool]

pwns pg 3

[leadfootedfool]

mwahahahaha.

[mpbiv]

DAG NABIT.

[mpbiv]

talk about post whoring 60+ replies in less than 2 days and only by a few people :D

[leadfootedfool]

i like the team idea.

i think ill be team kizzass yizzass $0l0 play. :naughty::naughty::naughty::boink::boink::boink::b ounce::bounce::bounce:

[mpbiv]

:wtf: was that?

[mpbiv]

I cannot translate eubonikz typing in the wee hours of the morning :haha:

[leadfootedfool]

haha
team ky solo play
damn nevermind
shutup brian SHUTUP!!

[mpbiv]

HMMMMMMMM

Well I think we all know what you have been looking at on the internet tonight :)

[mpbiv]

Watch out I might temporarily overthrow you in total posts :p

[mpbiv]

wow floodchecker thats cool :haha:

[leadfootedfool]

http://www.sheepusa.org/
oh mama

[leadfootedfool]

as you can see being here since october i havent really posted that much untill recently. damn how life gets in the way sometime

[mpbiv]

I also registered and just read posts for a few weeks before I decided to post anything :D

So who wants to own page 4?

[leadfootedfool]

and for all you exotic lovers
http://www.aussiesheep.com/
i just love an accent
baaahhhh gday haha

[mpbiv]

Not me I guess oh well. What time zone are you in? Its near 3am.

[mpbiv]

Thats whacked that they have a aussie sheep page.

Do I own page 4 yet?

[mpbiv]

Hehehe I just remembered that scene in Kingpin where they were trying to distract the other bowler and Vannessa Angel (the chick from weird science) couldnt distract the old farmer. So they put a goat near the lane. Guess he had a thing for goats like you people do for sheep :haha:

[leadfootedfool]

i dont know if its more disturbing the pages are there or that it took all of 30 sec to find both.

im sitting here in clearwater just cant sleep.
oh yea 30 threads a page its on.

[leadfootedfool]

that was hilarious in king pin
21 left

[mpbiv]

Hmmmm I figure you are waiting for me to post the 30th thread onto the page then :p

[leadfootedfool]

must pwn 2 in a row

[mpbiv]

BAH

Screw that. I may have post whored some but I am not broken in enough to go another 21 :D

[leadfootedfool]

unfortunately im on dialup till next week then oh so sweet road runner

[leadfootedfool]

come on man!! down to 15

[mpbiv]

You guys/gals have warped my fragile little mind only 80 something posts and I am already succumbing to post whoring.

[leadfootedfool]

just wait till jeff has you dreaming of sheep
ughghghhghg:barf::barf::eek::eek::barf: i think i need a shower

[mpbiv]

Well normally I have a T1 here at school but it seems the network administrator got lazy since this is exam week. So the network has been down and I have been forced to dial up to one of 2 Netzero servers in Gainesville. 56k truly does suck here. I get better 56k cons when I am in Ocoee.

[leadfootedfool]

uh oh

[leadfootedfool]

who owns it??

[mpbiv]

I should take a shower too since I aint doing much right now. I just got back from the SAE shop here at about 1:30. I was grinderizing some metal there so I am a little dirty and have little chips of metal on my shirt. Its fun feeding stell tubing to the belt sander its even more fun feeding the belt sander aluminum :D

[leadfootedfool]

damn!!

[mpbiv]

and I pwn page 4

[leadfootedfool]

i was talking about a hot shower due to the discusting thought of sheep haha. I put my tranny back in my neon tonight that was about as fun as putting myself in the belt sander.

[mpbiv]

LOL no belt sander accidents yet. Although I have seen somebody get hit in the head by a flying piece of debree(spelling?) from the CNC in our machine shop. Also seen someone get zapped by the tig welder. In retrospect its funny luckily no one got hurt seriously :D

[leadfootedfool]

BTW whats the deal with ufs sae car?? I have a friend in architecture who really wanted to join the team and said everybody was rather rude to him so hes never been back. My brother also went and said the same thing. I got both started in autoxing and they love it and are both gearheads.

USF doesnt currently have a formula sae team but myself and a couple friends are working on getting one started the funding has been the main problem but at least were getting it rolling.

[mpbiv]

Guess I need to get AOHell/GayOL instant messenger so that I dont keep doing this :)

How come nobody uses MSN or ICQ they are less gay than GayOL messenger? (well ok maybe ICQ isnt)

[leadfootedfool]

just get trillian. makes all your problems go away.

[leadfootedfool]

thats right

[leadfootedfool]

im a whore. a TRIPLE DIGIT whore. ok nevermind.

[mpbiv]

Well that depends on what year if it was this year than I can understand their point of view. There are a few people there that have been rather cocky this year its even caused me to spend less time helping out than I did in the past.

If it was last year than I wouldnt know UF SAE was a lot better last year had more people which was probably because of the team leader.

This year there has been like 4-5 hardcore people and they let a lot of their work go to their heads. There have been times when some of the people there made me feel like what I was doing didnt help them out so I would just say screw it often times.

Last year I was hardcore on it this year kind of show up when I am bored type thing.

[leadfootedfool]

Both of them went out fall this year. Its a shame really they are both extremely talented (mechanic machinist construction creativity wise) and would have brought alot to the team.

[leadfootedfool]

And no offense but whatever the team the work shouldnt go to there heads. Its probably not that significant. Now the guys from university of michigan(i think) last year that milled there own mini v8 from chunks of aluminum thats impressive. To bad it didnt run.

[mpbiv]

Not to mention last year we didnt get our car running till a week before competition. So only the drivers got seat time so that we could tune the car. Everyone who worked on it was promised seat time which most of us never saw even after the car came back from competition.

Someone also made a rule that even if you were supposed to get seat time last year and didnt that you wouldnt get any this year unless you worked on the new car a sufficient amount. That wouldnt have been so annoying except for the person that made the rule drove the old car the weekend before so he had gotten his seat time.

[leadfootedfool]

That really stinks especially since the old car is just sitting there while the new one is being built. That would almost annoy me enough for a bolt in the intake.

[mpbiv]

I think that was not Michigan thought it was Washington something. But anyways I agree with you it shouldnt go to their heads but nonetheless they had a way of making it seem like they were the core of the whole thing and that things couldnt run without them. Consequently they are suffering from that bullheadedness cause people dont stay and they dont have the same member base they had last year (fall 00-spring 01).

As for that V8 it was badass. I couldnt go to competition because my K-car spun the bearing weeks before school let out but from what I heard that engine sounded mean but the rest of the car wasnt as great. From what I understand they only designed the block and then just slapped some 250 heads on it. They have some mad funding over there. If we had that type of funding we would have a insane car. One of our biggest sponsors is Ford and because of the whole firestone thing and the wacky economy they had to give us a little less this time around :(

[leadfootedfool]

eyes closing cant stay awake much longer.
Ive got to go to sleep but i definately want to talk more about the formula sae car. I have an aim name surprise leadfootedfool but wont be on too much this week.

[mpbiv]

Yeah it was annoying cause it sat for most of the school year. Of course right now they are in such a hurry to get this years car together and have it tuned that they have stolen or bastardized some of the rear drivetrain and suspension parts from the old car onto the new one. Most of the stuff is relatively similar. Last year our car was a 95% redesign of the previous car and this years is improvement upon that one so things like suspension points are the same. Two major changes they made from our previous car are outboard disc brakes used to have only one on the diff housing. Also last year we had the sparkies aka electrical engineers make and build our own custom engine control unit. Unfortunately it didnt work so well at competition so we got 31 place (we were 4th year before). This year we are going back to the Motec.

[mpbiv]

Hmmm I guess Ill leave my modem on all night to download GayOL messenger. I am not tired I have gotten into bad sleeping habits the past few months not to mention I drank too much Dr P :haha:

[Iroc Joe]

*sniff* *sniff* would you look at this...our little noobs are growing up to be big post whores...so fast! *sniff* Its horrible! Enjoy the days you are young for once you get to be a full fledged post whore life goes downhill from there :D:D:D:D:D:D

[CrazyMoparGirl]

I got trillian and I got pwnd!!!! Hardcore in Vegas

[FearThe4Doors]

we

[FearThe4Doors]

had

[FearThe4Doors]

6

[FearThe4Doors]

wonderful

[FearThe4Doors]

pages

[FearThe4Doors]

of

[FearThe4Doors]

dodge

[FearThe4Doors]

writing

[FearThe4Doors]

genius.

[FearThe4Doors]

Now

[FearThe4Doors]

its

[FearThe4Doors]

getting

[FearThe4Doors]

personal!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mpbiv]

yes

[FearThe4Doors]

TR got PWNED!

[mpbiv]

guess I

[mpbiv]

better postwhore :evil5:

[FearThe4Doors]

Why

[FearThe4Doors]

not?

[FearThe4Doors]

TR Admins

[FearThe4Doors]

gave us

[FearThe4Doors]

permission to!

[mpbiv]

oh yes

[mpbiv]

they did

[mpbiv]

I just got the error message that explorer performed a illegal operation I hate computers :madfawk: Friggin POS

[mpbiv]

Maybe if I ignore the little window that says close it will go away :D

[CrazyMoparGirl]

Good thing we know how to post whore like the pros

[FearThe4Doors]

Thak goodness we dont have this problem.........

http://www.tamparacing.com/hebb/showthread.php?threadid=24331

and since when is power braking bad? Well unless youre a dumb fuck and holds the engine at 8000 rpm for 10 min. But who wouldnt know to not do that and who would need to get to 8000 rpm to get any power anyway? Opps... nevermind! :haha:

[mpbiv]

PH34R TH3 83NCH R1C1NG DUMFOKS

Ill take my nearly bulletproof 413 3spd non lockup over any import tranny anyday. And if someone wants to argue with me that the stock trans in imports are good then talk to the guy fixing the slushbox on my sisters Hyundai or the ASE certified mechanic I used to work with who had 13 yrs at a Honda Dealer.

[FearThe4Doors]

all the honduh kids give me such looks when i tell them im running an auto. Its unheard of in their little world. I simply reply with but I have torque and they get all :wtf: and go back into their corner talking about iceman intakes and how i dont know anything about cars b/c im running an auto. LOL.

Look at just about all the bracket racers out there.. they all run autos. Granted theyre powerglides but thats still an auto.

[mpbiv]

Can you say Torqueflite?????

Correct me if I am wrong but the 413s are termed torqueflites just like the 727s and 904s Chrysler made. Also correct me if I am wrong but the torqueflites have a reputation for being excellent auto transmissions that last a long time and can handle considerable power.

MOPAR PWNS

[FearThe4Doors]

for the most part youre right. Although the 413 isnt AS durable as the 727s and 904s.. it is pretty good. Turbo engines do give it a little trouble if you start upping the boost. THey especially hate high(er) boost at part throttle (if using a manual boost controller). But they can be blueprinted and beefed up using other stock parts from other ones and they become very nice!

[mpbiv]

Can someone explain this thing about blue printing? Does that mean they check all the clearances and tolerances to a factory and then draw up some sort of blue print?

When you say beefed up you mean extra clutch discs and different spider gears? I got this nice ATSG book on the A-413 which describes complete tear down and rebuild and also includes schematics of all the lines and passages the fluid flows through.

All this transmission stuff is fairly new to me only thing I have ever taken out was the valve body filter and torque converter :D

[FearThe4Doors]

blueprinting a trans engine carb whatever.. is basically tearing it apart and rebuilding it making sure everything is exactly in spec. No actual blueprints are involved i dont think.

Yes the front drum of the 413 is one of the big weak point (along with the valve body). The budget racers just stuff in an extra clutch pack into the drum. The better way to rebuild it is to either use a turbo mini trans or get the front drum out of a 3.0L 413 trans. Its bigger and holds more clutches yet fits (413 = 413... aint dodge smart!). People also tweak the VBs to make them shift better. Raise the line pressure. And put in heavier bearings.

[mpbiv]

Yeah I wish they would tag the 413s with a extra letter or something signifying the difference. I knew that some of them were different but not which ones. By chance is a turbo 413 (not including vans) different than my TBI 413?

[FearThe4Doors]

tbi 413s are the weakest. Then turbo cars and tbi vans. Then Turbo vans. (I believe the spiders are stronger in the vans). Im not sure overall how the V6 ones rate... but v6s are junk anyway. I do know they have the good front drum.. which the Turbo Minis also will have.

[BIG_Truck_Driver]

Just to clarify an earlier point Honda makes a shitty auto but the manuals handle well over 400HP with the addition of a quaffe lsd. all the pro drag guys run stock trannies.

[FearThe4Doors]

but honda guys need the gears to get the revs high and keep them high so they can be in their sweet spot.

[mpbiv]

Looks like the Mistu guys dont recognize one of their own

http://www.tamparacing.com/hebb/showthread.php?threadid=24431

[FearThe4Doors]

lol i dont know what the hell that thread turned into..........

[CrazyMoparGirl]

Of course it has a domestic badge

[mpbiv]

Hmm yeah I guess I was wrong to back Jeff up and call it a mitsu. I guess Ill keep quiet and just go install my Type R upgrade and be cool and stuff :haha:
http://www.tamparacing.com/hebb/upload/TypeRebuild.jpg

[FearThe4Doors]

you were right though. I think they thought you meant it was like the Laser was... a rebadged eclipse.

[mpbiv]

Yeah you know those body panels make the difference between fast or slow and Dodge or Mitsu to them :haha:

[mpbiv]

I need to steal Bobs sig whenever I venture out of the Mopar tech forum

http://www.tamparacing.com/hebb/showthread.php?threadid=24431

Some people get too touchy. I made that statment because the way he worded his post it seemed like he was trying to correct Jeff. I guess maybe he was just pissed cause the post was about people without cars/licenses/permits being on TR.

[BIG_Truck_Driver]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by FearThe4Doors
but honda guys need the gears to get the revs high and keep them high so they can be in their sweet spot.

This is also true but the autos are still shitty soon as you add serious goodies they break.

[FearThe4Doors]

thanks for making me more knowlegable on the honda transs Walter. And thanks for getting our back on the avenger thing. Youre one of them so they listen to you.. lol. We promise we wont tell them you have a dodge!

[mpbiv]

That same guy is still denying the 2.0L DOHC in those cars is DSM. He says its from the neon. I know someone in here was asking the DSM guys about what they could do with the 2.0 DOHC in the neon. Its still a DSM motor. Its the same as in the NA Eclipse.

I am like 99.99999999999999% sure its a DSM motor I know someone in Gainesville who drives one. He tried looking for Mopar Performance parts but with no luck then he found out it was a mitsu motor and found a lot of parts.

Correct me if I am wrong but the only neon motor that is Dodge made is the SOHC 16v (that must confuse the import people having only one cam but 16v).

[Iroc Joe]

The DOHC motors are mitsus.............Im 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999% sure

[FearThe4Doors]

what are the 2.4s then?

[Iroc Joe]

I was referring to the 2.0s...dunno about the 2.4s....could they share some characteristics (i.e. bottom ends as the ol 2.2/2.5s??) Oh god that would pwn if they did.

[mpbiv]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by FearThe4Doors
what are the 2.4s then?
I dunno stroked Chrysler 2.0 with a DOHC head? Who knows :D

[BIG_Truck_Driver]

actually I was pretty sure the 2.0 NA motor was a dodge motor the turbo 2.0 is the mitsu motor.

[mpbiv]

http://www.fwdmopar.com/sites/dennis/2.4RTpics3.html

The second pic of that 2.4L block has a big Chrysler pentastar cast into it if that makes a difference

[Iroc Joe]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by speed_daemon1
actually I was pretty sure the 2.0 NA motor was a dodge motor the turbo 2.0 is the mitsu motor.

perhaps the SOHC was...but I would bet my left nut the DOHC was the same as an n/a eclipse ;)

[mpbiv]

The DOHC is the only motor in question the SOHC is definitely genuine Mopar. Ever wonder why Mopar Performance only sells a 2.0L SOHC crate motor?

[BIG_Truck_Driver]

All I can say is the 2.0l motor in the na eclipse is the same motor as the neon dohc but mounted backwards from the neon.

[mpbiv]

From what I understood the NA DOHC in the Neon and the Eclipse are the same (rotational wise as well) but the Turbocharged DOHC Eclipse engine is reverse rotation of the NA motors and flipped around?

[Iroc Joe]

yes the 4g63 was different. Thats why you cant just drop one in any 2.0l factory car!

[FearThe4Doors]

heres what I know.

Talons/Eclipses came with both turbo and nonturbo 4g63 2.0L 16v dohc mitsy engines

I believe maybe the 2nd gen non turbo ones came with the 420A engine. Some of them did at least..

The 2.0 that was in the neons is most likely a dodge engine because the block is very similar to the 2.2/2.5s. I dont know if thats the 420a or not.

I believe the 2.4s are spawn of the 2.0.. probably just stroked like maurice said.

[mpbiv]

New rule: If no one can agree on what it is then its a DSM :p

[mpbiv]

Moreover since Dodge is one of the big 3 (if you still wanna call it that) we get to make all the rules :D

[CrazyMoparGirl]

the 2.0L in the mitsu is not the 2.0L from the neon nothing interchanges between the 2. except the cam gears.

[rb70383]

The DOHC 2.0L is a dodge motor. We have one in the garage. The 2.4L is a dodge. the 2.0 and 2.4 have in common MOL what the 2.2L and 2.5L have in common. Well the 2.4L is about 1 inch taller than a 2.0L. Walter remember Johns Neon with the 2.4L they had to tilt the engine back to get it to clear the hood. He also used the 2.0L intake. The head is the same also. I am not sure about the Mitsu versions as I have asked this before with no luck.

[mpbiv]

Ok so here is how it pieces together.

1) All neon engines are made by Dodge
2) The DOHC Avenger engine is exact same as NA Eclipse and are made by Mitsu.

The other night I was pretty sure the 2.0 DOHC was the same exact engine in both the NA Eclipse and Avenger. Then I went and looked at someones site on NA eclipses and now I am undeniably sure of this after seeing a pic of the engine in the eclipse. I already knew what the 2.0 DOHC in a Avenger looked like because my friend at school showed me his engine when he got headers and the motor is identical (I think even the valve covers are identical down to the lettering).

[BIG_Truck_Driver]

so the question left to answer:
the na eclipse with the 2.0 l motor is that a neon motor?

All of the DSM guys say it is. Im not too sure after reading all of the posts here.

[dan]

haha

who cares tho?

2.0l neon or 2.4 liter neon/eclipse = still slow as fuck

4g63 or bust

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by dan
4g63 or bust

heh... :thumbup:

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by speed_daemon1
so the question left to answer:
the na eclipse with the 2.0 l motor is that a neon motor?

All of the DSM guys say it is. Im not too sure after reading all of the posts here.

i dunno walter.. ive pulled 4g63 2.0 n/a heads off a few eclipses.. same engine basically as the turbo mitsys. So i know for a fact THOSE had mitsy engines. But I think they also had the 420as in them maybe later on. Those are the neon motors?

[BIG_Truck_Driver]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by FearThe4Doors
Originally posted by speed_daemon1
so the question left to answer:
the na eclipse with the 2.0 l motor is that a neon motor?

All of the DSM guys say it is. Im not too sure after reading all of the posts here.

i dunno walter.. ive pulled 4g63 2.0 n/a heads off a few eclipses.. same engine basically as the turbo mitsys. So i know for a fact THOSE had mitsy engines. But I think they also had the 420as in them maybe later on. Those are the neon motors?

That is what Im thinking but the neon has the timing belt on the passenger side right? intake on the front side exhaust on the back and tranny on the driver side?

when referring to the na eclipse I was referring to the curvy ones not the most recent but the gen before that. it is a totally different motor from the 4g63 the cam gears are a normal size unlike the 4g63s wagon wheels the exhaust is on the front I think the timing belt is on the passenger side and the tranny on the right.

[BIG_Truck_Driver]

whew page 7 for me

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by speed_daemon1
[quote="Someone"]That is what Im thinking but the neon has the timing belt on the passenger side right? intake on the front side exhaust on the back and tranny on the driver side?

Im pretty sure of all that. Its the same config as the turbo cars.

Originally posted by "Someone"

when referring to the na eclipse I was referring to the curvy ones not the most recent but the gen before that. it is a totally different motor from the 4g63 the cam gears are a normal size unlike the 4g63s wagon wheels the exhaust is on the front I think the timing belt is on the passenger side and the tranny on the right.

right when facing which way? Did they just swap cams and then switched the intake and exhaust manifolds? I guess (at least with neon dohc heads) that you can reverse the flow by swapping cams.

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by speed_daemon1
whew page 7 for me

you goddamn whore! youre hanging around in here with us too much lately! LOL

btw nice OWNED on that mark kid about his tire pressure. I was wanting to put something like that myself but didnt feel like everyone hating me again. If he cant even check his own tire pressure he doesnt need a car.. any car.

[FearThe4Doors]

my friend karen has a neon 2.0 sohc.. her moms bf says its a mitsy engine. But i dont know if he knows for sure or what. Just more fuel for the fire.

[BIG_Truck_Driver]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by FearThe4Doors
Originally posted by speed_daemon1
[quote="Someone"]That is what Im thinking but the neon has the timing belt on the passenger side right? intake on the front side exhaust on the back and tranny on the driver side?

Im pretty sure of all that. Its the same config as the turbo cars.

Originally posted by "Someone"

when referring to the na eclipse I was referring to the curvy ones not the most recent but the gen before that. it is a totally different motor from the 4g63 the cam gears are a normal size unlike the 4g63s wagon wheels the exhaust is on the front I think the timing belt is on the passenger side and the tranny on the right.

right when facing which way? Did they just swap cams and then switched the intake and exhaust manifolds? I guess (at least with neon dohc heads) that you can reverse the flow by swapping cams.

Right as in drivers side.

[CrazyMoparGirl]

Hi remember me the girl who had a 1st gen acr? The one who has all the books from Mopar Perofrmance on the Neon and their engines? According to Mopar the 2.0L Neon engine SOHC or DOHC are Dodge engines and share nothing with the Mitsu 2.0L. Case solved

[BIG_Truck_Driver]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by CrazyMoparGirl
Hi remember me the girl who had a 1st gen acr? The one who has all the books from Mopar Perofrmance on the Neon and their engines? According to Mopar the 2.0L Neon engine SOHC or DOHC are Dodge engines and share nothing with the Mitsu 2.0L. Case solved

Damn slow poke I have been waiting for your expert opinion but you didnt respond

[rb70383]

Worst case have the BF try and find the 3- diamond stars on the Neon motor :haha:

[CrazyMoparGirl]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by speed_daemon1
Originally posted by CrazyMoparGirl
Hi remember me the girl who had a 1st gen acr? The one who has all the books from Mopar Perofrmance on the Neon and their engines? According to Mopar the 2.0L Neon engine SOHC or DOHC are Dodge engines and share nothing with the Mitsu 2.0L. Case solved

Damn slow poke I have been waiting for your expert opinion but you didnt respond

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by CrazyMoparGirl
the 2.0L in the mitsu is not the 2.0L from the neon nothing interchanges between the 2. except the cam gears.

You obviously didnt read my post :D

[leadfootedfool]

Damnit i hate having to do this. Remember me the one who still owns a neon has all the mopar books has swapped engines and put lots of special bits in his neon?? The neon 2.0L share the block with the n/a mitsubishiseclipsestalons and the like. The block is the exact same piece the heads are different but the blocks are the same i ended up pulling a mitsu n/a block for my car for an even sicker engine but that is yet to come.

[leadfootedfool]

And yes the dohc is a dodge product not as every mitsu person will say a dsm. The block was designed by dodge borrowed by mitsu. The reason mopar sells sohc hi po crate motors is because they are the most popular in scca and a couple of classes where the neon is successful only allows the sohc.

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by leadfootedfool
Damnit i hate having to do this. Remember me the one who still owns a neon has all the mopar books has swapped engines and put lots of special bits in his neon?? The neon 2.0L share the block with the n/a mitsubishiseclipsestalons and the like. The block is the exact same piece the heads are different but the blocks are the same i ended up pulling a mitsu n/a block for my car for an even sicker engine but that is yet to come.

when you say mitsu n/a block... do you mean 4g63? or the dodge/neon 2.0?

[leadfootedfool]

Heres the thing from 1995 and later the 2.0l non turbo that was in the dsms was a chrysler engine. The heads are slightly different between the dsm and the neon dohc but they have an identical blockcrankrodspiston etc. I also believe but am not 100% that the earlier 1990 on 2.0 non turbo dsms have the same block. The turbo (4g63) is a dsm motor.

[CrazyMoparGirl]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by leadfootedfool
And yes the dohc is a dodge product not as every mitsu person will say a dsm. The block was designed by dodge borrowed by mitsu. The reason mopar sells sohc hi po crate motors is because they are the most popular in scca and a couple of classes where the neon is successful only allows the sohc.

I thought it was because they are running the 2nd gen Neons in D stock. The crate 2.0L is still considered a stock engine for SCCA (some modifications allowed) since the 2nd gen Neons only come SOHC.

[leadfootedfool]

Actually the crate motor came about for the sohc acr to be competitive in IT.

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by leadfootedfool
Heres the thing from 1995 and later the 2.0l non turbo that was in the dsms was a chrysler engine. The heads are slightly different between the dsm and the neon dohc but they have an identical blockcrankrodspiston etc. I also believe but am not 100% that the earlier 1990 on 2.0 non turbo dsms have the same block. The turbo (4g63) is a dsm motor.

Ok this makes SOOO much more sence... if its all correct at least. Which engine is the 420a?

[rb70383]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by leadfootedfool
Heres the thing from 1995 and later the 2.0l non turbo that was in the dsms was a chrysler engine. The heads are slightly different between the dsm and the neon dohc but they have an identical blockcrankrodspiston etc. I also believe but am not 100% that the earlier 1990 on 2.0 non turbo dsms have the same block. The turbo (4g63) is a dsm motor.

But are thye dsm engines mounted backwards compared to a Neon? If so do they run backwards or is revesal done in the tranny?

[CrazyMoparGirl]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by leadfootedfool
Heres the thing from 1995 and later the 2.0l non turbo that was in the dsms was a chrysler engine. The heads are slightly different between the dsm and the neon dohc but they have an identical blockcrankrodspiston etc. I also believe but am not 100% that the earlier 1990 on 2.0 non turbo dsms have the same block. The turbo (4g63) is a dsm motor.

I still have a hard time believing that the N/A blocks are the same from 95 and on due to what I was told by Chrysler Forward Motion Howell and CNNP when I was going to build up my Neon. I know that the earlier blocks are not the same. 90 N/A Dsms were Mitsus from what I was told and read. Not trying to contradict you just going by what I have been told in the past.

[leadfootedfool]

In order:
Jeff
http://www.2gnt.com/www/files/powertrain.htm
http://www.2gnt.com/www/ntfaq.htm

Bob
The non turbo dsms have the engine on the same side as the neon (engine passenger side tranny drivers side) and spin the same way.
Turbos have the engine on the wrong side (honda side drivers)spin the normal way but have another shaft in the tranny to correct it and make the car drive forward not backwards.

Lori
http://www.2gnt.com/www/files/powertrain.htm
http://www.2gnt.com/www/ntfaq.htm
When I cracked my block and was looking for another Howell told me the blocks were the same and after doing my own research (ie junkyards not just online) found out they are. Howell is truly the only reputable supplier of the bunch you mentioned. Ive been stiffed by FM before and havent ordered since. As far as CNNP they are an even larger bunch of crooks still have around $700 worth of charges on my credit card they wont refund. Good thing it was american express and they have taken care of it.

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by leadfootedfool
Bob
The non turbo dsms have the engine on the same side as the neon (engine passenger side tranny drivers side) and spin the same way.
Turbos have the engine on the wrong side (honda side drivers)spin the normal way but have another shaft in the tranny to correct it and make the car drive forward not backwards.

But.. according to http://www.2gnt.com/www/ntfaq.htm...

Q: Is my engine really the same as that in the Neon?
A: Basically yes. It is the same block and the head is similar. There are some differences:

- The engine is mounted opposite in the Neon. Intake in front exhaust out back. The intake and exhaust manifolds are different.

[leadfootedfool]

Believe nothing you see. The HEAD is mounted opposite the neon.
Pics of engine
http://www.2gnt.com/www/corbin/comp.html
http://www.2gnt.com/www/corbin/vc.html

Second pic isnt as clear but the engine is definitely on the passenger side.

[FearThe4Doors]

werd!

So maybe you can verify this for me.. ive heard you can reverse the flow of a neon head by swapping the cams. Is it true? Of course manifolding will be changed too.

And which is better? the mitsy head or neon head? Iffn theyre not the same yet bolt up to the same block. Would a Mitsy head on a neon make anything better? Besides more room to mount a turbo.... :evil2:

[FearThe4Doors]

also maybe i read over it somewhere.. but ok the blocks are the same. But its a DODGE block not MITSY block right?

[mpbiv]

Wow thats a lot of information to read. Glad someone finally explained everything and now it all makes sense. But then again I dont have a 2.0L so no worries here :D

[leadfootedfool]

I dont know about swapping cams. I dont even think it would run because of the difference in valve sizes and intake/exhaust ports. If you reversed the head maybe but then it wouldnt work due to cams now being on the wrong side.
If you wanted a turbo neon i think the mitsu head would be better simply to get more air over it and have a cooler setup. If you want all motor the neon is the way to go. I think the mitsu made less hp simply due to the setup of all the hot air getting into the intake manifold. And yes the neon dohc is overrated at 150 UNTILL you centerline the cams.

Most importantly it is a dodge block all have a pentastar on them.

[rb70383]

Do the Turbo mitsus use the same bellhousing pattern as a non-turbo? Ie interchangeable trannys? Also is the exhaust on front on the non-Td If so then the nonT head is mounted backwards right with exhaust pointing forward? Any other sites like this? When we first started trying to build the Neon _96) I guess a lot of the aftermarket Howell etc.... didnt know what will interchanger between the 2 cars yet. :( Hence some of our incorrect info. I looked at a nonT mitsu in cophers and got all discombobulated. come to found out after this the engine was mounted on the wrong (honda) side. DAMNIT that car must have been a Turbo one...........:nono:

[Iroc Joe]

I gave the thread a better name! Now if you ever need to reference back to it.....its easier to find :):D

[leadfootedfool]

The turbo mitsus do NOT use the same tranny/bellhousing. The non turbos use the same tranny that is in the neon the dodge tranny.

The exhaust is on the front of the non turbo mitsu head it is mounted opposite of the neon.

As far as the neon aftermarket about 5 years ago it consisted of the iceman intake and that was about it. It took a while for people to realize the potential.

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by 87IROC
I gave the thread a better name! Now if you ever need to reference back to it.....its easier to find :):D

Wow Joe youre my FUCKING HERO! :fawk::fawk::spoke:

[leadfootedfool]

Keep in mind everything Ive said so far is for 2nd gen dsms (1995-1999).

1st gen non turbo dohc (sohc was a 1.8 l) was mounted on the drivers side so the one you saw at copher was probably a non turbo.

http://www.camalott.com/~eclipsed/findex.html

Im not sure about the 1990-1994 non turbo as being a chrysler though.

[leadfootedfool]

Revelation.

420a is non turbo 2.0l 2nd gen used from 1995-1999. Chrysler engine.

4g63 is non turbo 2.0l 1st gen used from 1990-1994. Mitsu engine.

4g63t is turbo 2.0l 1st and 2nd gen used from 1990-1999. Mitsu engine.

Bottom ends not even close between 420a and 4g63. Completely different tranny/bellhousing.

[FearThe4Doors]

bout time page 8 showed up! LOL i was getting tired of scrolling down thru the entire #7 every time!

[BIG_Truck_Driver]

Originally posted by "Someone"

Originally posted by leadfootedfool
Revelation.
420a used in non turbo 2nd gen dsms is chrysler engine.
4g63 is non turbo 2.0l used from 1990-1994. Mitsu engine.
4g63t is turbo 2.0l used from 1990-1999. Mitsu engine.

So what is the engine code for the neon 2.0 dohc motor?

[leadfootedfool]

D4RE is the dodge dohc

S4RE is the dodge sohc

420a is the mitsu designation of the engine, as previously mentioned with the different head.

[rb70383]

actually more like 7yrs ago with no mods for a neon. Around 97 Mopar listed all the ACR stuff as upgrades to other neons the the RT neon came out. I was pissed all the good shit finally comes out when we got rid d of Loris neon. :( OK Got any sites that show the AWD from an eclipse/3000gt lancer?

[leadfootedfool]

Originally posted by "FearThe4Doors"

bout time page 8 showed up! LOL i was getting tired of scrolling down thru the entire #7 every time!

Page 8 showed up???? What a dumbass.

[FearThe4Doors]

[/siz]

[BIG_Truck_Driver]

What are you talking about this is page 9!

[leadfootedfool]

haha

[FearThe4Doors]

i give up!! :lol: :lol:

[rb70383]

dirty neon head
http://communities.msn.com/_Secure/0OwAtD5AT1SEnALb6ZfHZ68vaLROT0t*qu1AdcpmpOIjRckwai Y8V*marjHqzuP1MCw4lc0RC5MFmRCH6ejQQxxLevExBhZ7V/Image001-(3).jpg

[rb70383]

and block
http://communities.msn.com/_Secure/0OwAAAJETByInALb6ZfHZ66!FVUgM2lqRp06bLcgs9qXMC*Usy 5YFCisrHSDhtRSvMOXw5WfeQSoZl8Nr!QVq9d5YonTS4wiV/Image002-(3).jpg

[rb70383]

http://communities.msn.com/_Secure/0PABkGvcTHzgnALb6ZfHZ6wQ7innO1x2llTqrce2DTk3jwwc55 Ii8DS9W1UMofaBeKPcCdI*XIJj*!D9vCll4HsRL*Qzhdb1E/Image008(1).jpg

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "rb70383"

dirty neon head
http://communities.msn.com/_Secure/0OwAtD5AT1SEnALb6ZfHZ68vaLROT0t*qu1AdcpmpOIjRckwai Y8V*marjHqzuP1MCw4lc0RC5MFmRCH6ejQQxxLevExBhZ7V/Image001-(3).jpg

Yummy

[FLNeonRT]

Can someone please verify the engine code for the DOHC Neon R/T engines. I was under the assumption it was 420A. Please clarify.

[CrazyMoparGirl]

Mopar Performance classify's the Neon engine as a 2.0L SOHC/DOHC I have never heard it called a 420A.

[leadfootedfool]

Here we go again.

Mitsu dohc engine code 420a

Dodge dohc no official engine code, the engine code thing is really a japanese thing. It is simply referred to as 2.0 dohc. If you really want to nit pick d4re is an engine code if you have to have one, but it is simply the 2.0 l dohc.

all dohcs had the same hp ratings, no matter r/t, sport, acr. There are differences in years, 95 was obd 1, 97+ they switched injector styles, just do your homework if your planning a swap.

[leadfootedfool]

I think we should name this thread neons.org leftovers.

[mpbiv]

LOL this is getting confusing :lol:

I'll stick with 2.2/2.5 combos, no mitsu confusion there :wink:

Ok now for a new question. They used to have a mitsu Hemi 2.6 in K-cars. Was the head unique to only Dodge versions or do all mitsu 2.6's have hemi heads. Sorry I had to ask :D

Also a friend of mine commented that the SOHC head on a neon display engine at school appeared to have hemispherical combustion chambers, is it a hemi head? He is into old Mopars (his dad has two cudas and two sport furys, and he is looking to build his own Cuda because his 69 Z28 is too slow :) ).

[rb70383]

Originally posted by "mpbiv"

LOL this is getting confusing :lol:

I'll stick with 2.2/2.5 combos, no mitsu confusion there :wink:

Ok now for a new question. They used to have a mitsu Hemi 2.6 in K-cars. Was the head unique to only Dodge versions or do all mitsu 2.6's have hemi heads. Sorry I had to ask :D

Also a friend of mine commented that the SOHC head on a neon display engine at school appeared to have hemispherical combustion chambers, is it a hemi head? He is into old Mopars (his dad has two cudas and two sport furys, and he is looking to build his own Cuda because his 69 Z28 is too slow :) ).

Yip basically all new cylinder heads are hemi style.

[mpbiv]

Originally posted by "rb70383"

LOL this is getting confusing :lol:

I'll stick with 2.2/2.5 combos, no mitsu confusion there :wink:

Ok now for a new question. They used to have a mitsu Hemi 2.6 in K-cars. Was the head unique to only Dodge versions or do all mitsu 2.6's have hemi heads. Sorry I had to ask :D

Also a friend of mine commented that the SOHC head on a neon display engine at school appeared to have hemispherical combustion chambers, is it a hemi head? He is into old Mopars (his dad has two cudas and two sport furys, and he is looking to build his own Cuda because his 69 Z28 is too slow :) ).

Yip basically all new cylinder heads are hemi style.
You mean in general or just all new neon heads? I hope you don't mean in general because then there wouldn't be nothing special about the 5.7 Hemi :(

Thats ok I don't consider the new 5.7's a Hemi is the Mopar Muscle car sense :) (needs more cubes)

[CrazyMoparGirl]

Originally posted by "leadfootedfool"

I think we should name this thread neons.org leftovers.

If we were going to do that we would have to have the entourage of no it all little punks that should be in Honda's, sorry but neons.org IMO is a waste of bandwidth.

[FearThe4Doors]

what I cant get enough of.. is that I started this thread up in NJ as I was bored outta my mind one day. So I made it just as temporary entertainment.. and to give myself 20 more posts. LOL Then it turned into the "look at the idiots on TR" thread. It just wont die! It's even been thru a terrorist attack and a move!

IT PWN5

[CrazyMoparGirl]

well what can you say but we know how to get the long posts :D we rule

[mpbiv]

Originally posted by "CrazyMoparGirl"

well what can you say but we know how to get the long posts :D we rule
Mopar Tech @ TR PWNZ ALL

Everyone else ------>:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :monkpiss: <------Mopar :)

[CrazyMoparGirl]

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

You are getting the idea

[CrazyMoparGirl]

This is very fitting for the thread :D

[mpbiv]

Now if we could get pics of the three different heads on these engines :)

[mpbiv]

Originally posted by "CrazyMoparGirl"

This is very fitting for the thread :D
Hey I can sell my balance shafts to that neon owner :lol:

I didn't realize it was animated till 10 mins after, damn 56k :lol:

[CrazyMoparGirl]

you need to get a beter internet connection yup you sure do, slow mofo

[FearThe4Doors]

does anyone else feel me?

http://www.tamparacing.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=243991#243991

[leadfootedfool]

Well hell yea i need a carbon fiber hood if i want to keep a/c in my race car.

[FearThe4Doors]

The import "tuner"s solution to needing more power...

http://www.tamparacing.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=25800

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[FearThe4Doors]

this troubles me......

"but keep in mind, every degree u change the intake cam you change your ignition timing 2. "

http://www.tamparacing.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=25804

unless DOHC's are different... cam timing has nothing to do with ingnition timing. Both timings are relative to the crank (TDC), not each other.. :dunno:

[mpbiv]

Originally posted by "FearThe4Doors"

this troubles me......

"but keep in mind, every degree u change the intake cam you change your ignition timing 2. "

http://www.tamparacing.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=25804

unless DOHC's are different... cam timing has nothing to do with ingnition timing. Both timings are relative to the crank (TDC), not each other.. :dunno:
Well from what I remember working with a mechanic, a lot of the hondas we had come in have distributors which are driven off the cam. So I can kind of understand what he means except for the part about "2" unless he meant it as "too"

[mpbiv]

Originally posted by "FearThe4Doors"

The import "tuner"s solution to needing more power...

http://www.tamparacing.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=25800

:lol: :lol: :lol:
Its amazing how much money they will spend just to put another N/A engine into a car.

I like the people who add adjustable cam pulleys and think they add a lot of power. They are worthless unless you know how to tune them for your application, not that they can make a big hp difference anyways. But then again with all these N/A swaps people do maybe those 1-2 ponies are crucial :dunno:

[CrazyMoparGirl]

or if they are adjusting them while on a dyno

[FearThe4Doors]

Originally posted by "mpbiv"

this troubles me......

"but keep in mind, every degree u change the intake cam you change your ignition timing 2. "

http://www.tamparacing.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=25804

unless DOHC's are different... cam timing has nothing to do with ingnition timing. Both timings are relative to the crank (TDC), not each other.. :dunno:
Well from what I remember working with a mechanic, a lot of the hondas we had come in have distributors which are driven off the cam. So I can kind of understand what he means except for the part about "2" unless he meant it as "too"

That makes sence if the dist is on the cam.

[rb70383]

All distributors turn at cam speed. SO They are driven off of it, and there for if the cam moves the timing will move. Hence why gear drive. Makes for rock solid timing.