suspension design, whats better, worse and why??

[TIM TIM TIM]

A question for you more educated old folk!

there are several different factory suspension set ups.. What are the advantages over one or another, what are disadvantages and how do they all work????

[Outkasted24]

Are you referring to a specific make of vehicle or is this just a broad question?

[jonBODON]

short arm long arm best handling hands down.

if you looking for a good suspeion from a vehicle.
front idk, anything thats a nice short arm long arm type suspeion.
as for rear, 300zx one of the most kick ass irs by far, so much design in there system. os gnarly.
mustang2 shit is good. you can find it on a few factory setups.
for drag racing tho get a solid axle(9inch or whatever you find to your taste) my cars solid axle!! ftw. but i dont drag race. anyways, now just havnig the solid axle isnt good, you need to set up a good 4 link, or trianglulated 4 link so on and so forth, so uch you can do for solid axles and im to lazzy to name.
micpherson design is good too for like a street driven car that ya want to handle. wont ever touch short arm long are, but most cars are micpherson desgin. and im spelling that wrong, so sorry.

idk i dont know much but i know a bit. i got abunch of info on suspeion if ya wanna do anything pm or somthin. ill prob post info later on different types and pros and cons. i just dont have time now.

[TIM TIM TIM]

this question is very broad but im more thinking of what I see on my integra, sisters bmw and my old 02 mustang gt, there all differant and im sure there are many other designs and I just want to know whats good and bad about each, If diagrams, pictures or half ass stick drawings can be included that would rock also:)

[jonBODON]

aight, ive just been cleaning my place, but when i get a chance i have lots of info nad i can get some good pics.

[TIM TIM TIM]

sweet rep will be given

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

suspension design, whats better, worse and why??


Depends on the application. Drags generally like a straight axle. Road like independent. Lots and lots of variables with suspensions and what is best for which car, application, driver.

[treekiller]

this is a very broad question with just as many answers. SLA vs. double wishbone, vs. macpherson.. anything can be made to work in your application, with some just slightly easier to tune. the best answer as to what is the best... whatever you have just tune it to work for your needs. like was mentioned elarier, modified locators, multiple links. diffrent geometry can make most any setup do exactly what you want.... now is there somthing to work with?

[senor honda]

In my book, adjustability determines what suspensions are "best".

I believe this, because I lower cars with OEM springs and stock adjusters.

I take stock adjusters right up to the limit on the performance side
to make the car handle to the "feel" of the user. I have found ways of expanding those limits also, by altering/tweaking adjusters.

You can win with anything, and anything will handle well, if you understand how suspensions work, and most of the time, it can be done for a lot less money than some people think. I also do a good job installing
high dollar suspension components, for those people who think that is the route to go.-Bob

[TIM TIM TIM]

ok let me narrow the topic a little, Im looking more in the autox/every day driving.. I know with drag you want it as lose as possible for weight transfer but im thinking more of good handling, quick corners with a decent ride. not so much what can I do to my car just in general whats better and what cars it may come on

[treekiller]

Weight, Weight, Weight..... oh and Weight. like I said each design just takes a diffrent approach. I'm able to pull .97 g's on street tires with macpherson front struts and a solid beam (twist axle) there are a lot of guys here that will reccomend a specific design based on what they know. this is wrong. everything is adjustable, everything can be changed to do what you want. (the important thing is knowing what you want) If anyone tells you that Short Long Arm is the only autocross suspension then look at BMW and tell me they can't autocross..

Lightweight, good contact patch proper camber curves, and good damping combined with the right springrate is more important. and If this Seinior Honda keeps using this forum to advertise his services as a reccomendation on EVERY POST there is going to be a problem.

Regardless, look for weight, sure SLA's are a bit easier to tune, but know what? my car that is setup correctly will allways beat a car with better "bones" that is setup by some Joker. who thinks Compression valving is a VTEC function.

[TIM TIM TIM]

so the "tuning", tires and weight are what make the handling over a certian style of suspension is what Im gathering here.. Correct?

[jonBODON]

sry i havnt posted that info yet ive been very busy, just wanted to say i havnt forgoten tho.

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

so the "tuning", tires and weight are what make the handling over a certian style of suspension is what Im gathering here.. Correct?

The tuning goes further than tires and curb weight but yes, it is in the tuning and it never ends.

[TIM TIM TIM]

and I thought drag racing got expencive, you almost need to be able to afford a viper to be able to race a regular car :lol:. unfortunatly I wont be out for atleast a year in my car :(.

[senor honda]

I concur with treekiller that each design just takes a different approach, and weight is certainly an additional factor.

I mention my experiences to give some creditability to what I say, and I further agree with him about a car that is set up correctly. We ALL agree that .97 G's on street tires is remarkable.-Bob

[treekiller]

yes tuning is the key, anyone can bolt parts on a car. a real professional knows what to do next. simple changes in suspension geometery can yeild big results. biggest mistake most people make is going too low. yea it looks purposeful but usually lacks in application. without adjusting how the suspension reacts to the changes youve made you can be spending a lot of time and money uselessly. this does take time but a day with a pyrometer a tape measure and some wrenches (and knowing who to ask) and most cars will behve completely diffrently

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

and I thought drag racing got expencive, you almost need to be able to afford a viper to be able to race a regular car :lol:. unfortunatly I wont be out for atleast a year in my car :(.

Sure, to actually road race will cost some bucks but you can open track any car as long as it is in good mechanical condition. And tracking is where you get your seat time which is more important than the car.

[burgy240]

and I thought drag racing got expencive, you almost need to be able to afford a viper to be able to race a regular car :lol:. unfortunatly I wont be out for atleast a year in my car :(.

^ What if you own 2 Vipers and race one of them;)

[TIM TIM TIM]

Sure, to actually road race will cost some bucks but you can open track any car as long as it is in good mechanical condition. And tracking is where you get your seat time which is more important than the car.

yeah, I really want to start hitting the track in the car the way it is for now, I just need to wait untill I can afford to fix anything that will break, get new tires and brakes as well (after the track).

[senor honda]

After you sign up for one of the autocross schools...............
(usually before an autocross-schedules are in the autocross forum)

after you sign up for one, if you want to get together beforehand, and talk suspension tuning, get back with me.

Depending on what day, if you want some setup help at the school,
itself, that might be fun. -Bob

[Nereth]

I don't get it, why is a live rear axle good for drag racing?

The only advantage I can see is the suspension geometry not changing in squat. But I can see a handful of disadvantages that nicely counteract that one.

[TIM TIM TIM]

I don't get it, why is a live rear axle good for drag racing?

The only advantage I can see is the suspension geometry not changing in squat. But I can see a handful of disadvantages that nicely counteract that one.

like?

[Nereth]

like?

- unequal rear tire loadings in most setups, decreasing traction through tire load sensitivity

- general inability to keep traction after small bumps, due to unsprung weight

- general inability to keep traction during small bumps, due to camber being linked between the two wheels

Basically the standard disadvantages of a live rear axle.

If having the tires perpendicular to the road is so important, you could just use a dedion tube setup, and if that can't be done (for strength reasons or whatever), then an IRS with a positive camber at rest, and a decent amount of antisquat, can also be used.

If I am right and the suspension geometry not changing in squat is the only reason you guys like them, I really think some different options should be considered. Maybe I'm missing the real reason, anyone wanna share?