Okay... No more alignments at the Tire Kingdom @ 301&60. Ever.

[jaball77]

I've been going to the TK at 301 and 60 for a while now, and they seem to have done okay in the past, but after my last alignment for the Miata it felt wacky. So I decided to take it to Cars & Concepts (like everyone's been telling me to...)... Well, either TK's new tech has no clue what he's doing, or their machine is broken (or both!), because the alignment I got from them was WHACKED OUT.

Front camber was -2.2/-1.8. I had about a half a degree of total toe out in the front, which is HUGE - like 5 times what it should have been.

Rear camber was -1.9/-3.0, with MASSIVE toe out on the left, and toe out on the right...

So 2 hours and $128 later, I have a SWEET alignment from Cars & Concepts... -1.5 degrees camber front, -1.6 rear, 0.05 deg toe out front, and 0 toe rear. Dan hit the specs DEAD ON, too...within 0.01 degrees on all counts.

Car feels WAY better, haha.

It's a great shop too. Everyone seems to genuinely be "into" their cars. Dan is a Miata nut so we shot the bull while he was working... Nice place.


So, to summarize - TK: BAD. C&C: GOOD. JBALL: HAPPY. :)

[Mars_302]

thats what happens when the alignment guy makes shit for doing his job at chain stores.

[Muddy]

I have always been pleased with the results when I get my car aligned at C&C. :)

[Mars_302]

id liek to get my car done at c&c, but not for $130. You cant even align the rear of my car anyway

[Jordan Y.]

Yeah, is that the standard rate for alignments there? That's a bit too much for me to spend right now. I could only see spending up to about 100 bucks.

[jaball77]

Yeah, is that the standard rate for alignments there? That's a bit too much for me to spend right now. I could only see spending up to about 100 bucks.

It looks like it's not a standard flat rate. If your car takes longer, they charge you more... I was there a total of about two hours. They wrote the ticket up as 1.6 hours @ $80/hr. When I asked for an estimate on the phone they said "Anywhere from $100-$250, and it'll take between 2 and 4 hours", heh.

For what you get it seems worth it to me. Mine was all wacked out and it took him less than 2 hours to reel it all in and get it perfect.

Would you rather pay $80 for a crappy alignment, or $130 for a perfect one? :D

[Jordan Y.]

If those are the only two options, I'd go for the 130 dollar job. Hopefully there's something in between, if not, I'll have to give them a try and hope it doesn't take long enough to max out my credit card. :oops:

[jaball77]

If those are the only two options, I'd go for the 130 dollar job. Hopefully there's something in between, if not, I'll have to give them a try and hope it doesn't take long enough to max out my credit card. :oops:

I really should amend my original post... Maybe "No more alignments are the TK at 301 and 60" would be more accurate...

The guy that used to work there (Chili) seemed pretty competent. The last time I went there, there was a different guy, and obviously the machine was out of calibration...

Jeremy (aka "w0rd" on TR) went to the TK in Seffner, and he said they had a pretty new looking Hunter alignment machine and seemed happy with the work there...

So painting all TK's with the same brush probably isn't fair... They're all independent shops. I was just so steamed this morning that my rage boiled over to all TK's, heh.

[Jordan Y.]

I just set up an appointment at Cars and Concepts for Thursday morning. I was quoted between 150 and 200; we'll just have to see what it comes out to in the end. I really don't like spending this much on an alignment but I want specific settings and I have aftermarket adjustments in the suspension so I don't feel comfortable going to regular old alignment shops. The shop my family usually uses for their cars would probably just berate me for modifying my suspension and question my custom settings, so it's worth the premium to avoid that, I guess.

[Presidential_Detail]

Thats what Im worried about when i go to get an alignment. My car is set up just the way i like it at the moment(im scared to change it:lol:) but it does handle very nicely. I almost NEVER encounter under OR oversteer(maybe a lil) on the street, which is perfect. On the track however I get alot of understeer which is probably nomal b/c im still a rookie driver and I think my instructor was a lil too used to his RWD, but I didnt want to go against what my instructor had to say.


BUT ANYWAYS.....I basically just want to get my car to drive straight(toe) but dont know what the toe should be set at for my racing purposes. And I still have no clue what caster is, i still need to research that. any help?btw its a honda civic hatch(EK).

[jblaine]

Think of caster as the "rake"... kinda...

[Jordan Y.]

*they took down the picture :(*

More caster is better. You gain camber in corners and it improves straight-line stability (tracking). The only downside is increased steering effort which doesn't really matter with power steering.

Toe settings for racing purposes and toe settings that get the car to drive in a straight line with minimal steering input are usually two different things. The ideal settings for auto-x for my car would make it twitchy and uncontrollable on the highway. You have to compromise.

You should be able to find a forum that has good handling information that will let you make choices on these settings. It's a Civic- the information has to be out there.

[D-Roll]

XAT did my alignment :)

[chi town brat]

I had the coupe aligned at the Melbourne TK and bought the 3 year plan because well its just the coupe . They did a good job .

Then we replaced my suspension on the coupe so I had the alignment done at the TK at 301 & 60 because I can drop the car off and walk to work . They stripped the lug nut to which I can only say my bad for not telling them to not impact the one wheel when they balanced the tires that day because I was also getting that done . They could not get the toe to zero

Then I had the lugnut replaced which means a new wheel bearing replaced (well now I have two brand new wheel bearings on an old car at least) and so I had the Melbourne TK do it and toe is zero and camber is way better . Good techs over there . They listen

Now for my 91 hatch, he has an appointment with Cars and Concepts because Barry has been very happy with thier work on his cars.

So yea i feel ya

Melbourne TK yes Brandon TK no

[Jordan Y.]

I had the car aligned at Cars and Concepts. Man, that was totally worth the extra money spent. It only took Dan 1.5 hours to take my car from over 1 degree toe-in up front (!!!), wacked camber all around, and other complications to almost perfect all the way around. I talked to him for a good 10-15 minutes when I got there discussing what I wanted and asking him questions and with his input decided on settings. Then when I came back to pick it up I talked to him again for probably 5-10 minutes discussing the results. My car has had a rough life- I slid it sideways into a curb a few years back and tweaked the left suspension, and though I replaced most of the suspension pieces and got it mostly into line the mounting points are still bent. I also welded my rear toe/control arms to eliminate active toe but managed to lock them into the wrong position while welding them. Despite all this he got all but the back left where I wanted them (back left was too tweaked for stock adjustment- I'll get some aftermarket tubular toe arms to fix my poor weld job and get some more tire clearance while I'm at it before my next alignment). Overall the shop had a good atmosphere, people working there seemed like real enthusiasts, and it's the kind of place where they won't do shoddy work for less money, only high-quality stuff there.

In conclusion- Cars and Concepts= worth the premium.

[Jordan Y.]

Oh, and the difference in the way the car drives is tremendous. It drives straighter, handles better, the steering is VASTLY improved, and it actually seems to accelerate faster and at first glance is getting significantly better gas mileage, the last two because of the massive toe it had previously.

[djben]

Had my M3 into Cars and Concepts for an alignment and corner balance and everyone there was very friendly, Danny did most of the work and he was great.

[jaball77]

Oh, and the difference in the way the car drives is tremendous. It drives straighter, handles better, the steering is VASTLY improved, and it actually seems to accelerate faster and at first glance is getting significantly better gas mileage, the last two because of the massive toe it had previously.

Heh. It's amazing what a difference it makes when all your wheels are pointing in the same direction. :D