Bad habits?

[Mars_302]

Alright a while ago, I asked about fill race tires and most of you said I should wait and work out bad habits I might have? What are some of the bad habits you guys refer too?

The only thing I really notice I do is something Tony mentioned to me was slowing down and planning ahead. I dont think a habit like that is gonna make a difference from tires. What are some of the ones you guys had?

[PseudoRealityX]

the main one from street tires to race tires is for someone to be using the tire to it's full effectiveness.

race tires allow for much more aggressive inputs, which for someone who's still thrashing around, will work, but not well. street tires don't like those inputs, and you'll just push everywhere. staying on street tires will keep you smooth, and teach you to drive with what you have. going to race tires immediately is sorta like trying to learn to drive in a ferrari. sure it's faster, but you'll never get 100% of out it.

[Leonard]

As Jesse said, race compound tires will tolerate far more agressive inputs than street compound tires. The problem is that it's difficult to become a smoother driver on race tires once you learn to drive within the threshold of what they'll allow because they don't give you negative feedback when your inputs are too agressive. If you stick with street tires until you're smooth enough for those, you'll be a LOT faster.

I'm still struggling with becoming smooth because I made the transition too early (despite the advice of others). Driving with agressive inputs has become second nature for me because it's how I drove for so long. It's hard to undo that.

When my old kumho's are spent, I'm putting street tires on the FFR for a while. It's very intolerant of harsh inputs (even with race tires) because of it's short wheelbase and weight distribution. Driving it is kind of like driving a merry go round.

I promise that if you stick with street tires you'll be faster in the end.

Do what you want.

[nunyo]

Yeah what they said. And just to clarify I meant to slow down your inputs to the steering wheel, not necessarily to slow the car down. The goal is to become smooth. If you want to see what this looks like, watch Keith Robertson or Danny Shields on course. It's like buttah.

[flmcoupe]

street tires will teach you smoothness! steering input, throttle application and braking! Plus they're cheaper! :)

[Rosko]

Mars, if I remember correctly we have the same tires (Yokohama AV ES100). Just out of curiosity, where did you buy them and what did you pay? Granted, we use different sizes, but stilll...

I bought mine at Wheel Tec for $150 per tire.

[_Charles_]

my 'bad habit'? Over agressiveness that lead to a lack of Smoothness. After I had Loren ride with me, I calmed down, and went just as fast. Smoothness.

[Loren]

Here's what you should shoot for. Get smooth enough that you're just barely hearing the tires sing to you on every turn on the course. That's telling you that you are right at, but not beyond the limit of the tires. You should be accelerating smoothly enough to not lose traction and braking early/smoothly enough that you're not locking up. You should be doing all of the above CONSISTENTLY, only allowing yourself to make mistakes maybe on your first run of the day.

When you're there, have someone like Jesse take a couple runs in your car. If they don't beat your time by more than half a second, THEN you might be ready for race tires. If they are notably faster than you, you need to find out why.

Here's one of the best simple things you can read to help you become a better autocross driver:
ANDY'S TOP TEN AUTOX DRIVING TIPS (http://www.dmvrscca.org/topten.htm)

[Mars_302]

Originally posted by Rosko
Mars, if I remember correctly we have the same tires (Yokohama AV ES100). Just out of curiosity, where did you buy them and what did you pay? Granted, we use different sizes, but stilll...

I bought mine at Wheel Tec for $150 per tire.

225/45/16 I paid $100+12+tax+fees a piece
245/45/16 I paid $110+the usual stuff

I get them from Georges Wholesale Tire in weeki wachee. My best friends father is like a general manager there, so I get em a few dollars over cost. When I bought the 225/45 I saved $50 over going to Advance which is what a lot of ppl recommend.

Thanks for the clarification. I think my problem with being smooth is I dont really have the course memorized to well. Im always just looking to the next cone. I do the walk thru, but that just gave me an idea of whats out there. I usually dont have the course memorized in some parts till the last run or two.

Im not gonna try race tires anytime soon. if anything I will just move up to a more stickier street tires if I can find something like that.

Thanks again

[Leonard]

You'll learn the course better on walkthroughs with more experience. If you ever get the chance to do a walkthrough when Danny Shields is leading it, DO it. You'll learn something. I've done two walkthroughs with him since I got the FFR and I've picked up stuff I never realized before.

One other thing. The tires last a LOT longer when you drive smooth.

[flmcoupe]

Thanks for the clarification. I think my problem with being smooth is I dont really have the course memorized to well. Im always just looking to the next cone. I do the walk thru, but that just gave me an idea of whats out there. I usually dont have the course memorized in some parts till the last run or two.

Walking the course is very important, looking ahead is just as important, more important to me! Master that skill and you'll become very smooth!

Walk the course with experienced drivers and ask them to show you how to look ahead.

[Loren]

Remember, you can't fix where you are... you can only control where you're going. So looking at the cone right in front of you is pointless. You need to be looking at the next turn and beyond. Always thinking ahead.

Something else it would be helpful for you to read is the Roger Johnson course design guide (search for it, it's not hard to find, I've posted a link to it here before I'm sure). It gets you inside the course designer's head and can teach you a lot of things to look for when you walk the course.

[PseudoRealityX]

something that Tony said to me that made things easier to understand the theory of going fast...as pointed out from some other fast dude who has better diction than me...;)

"you want to go as fast as you possibly can while keeping the car exactly where you want it."


in other words, if you want to know when you've pushed too far??

if you can't put the car where you want it, you're pushing too hard in that particular area.

[sloaccord]

on a side note, if you're as cheap as i am, a good way to get full race tires is to find a road racer with the tire size you want- when they're mostly useless for road racers, tires are generally perfect for a autocrosser. and much cheaper, if not free.
"hey, want me to throw those tires out for you?" hehe

[Durdan]

i once saw a lola race car with a label maker tag on the dash and it helped me alot throughout the years

"drive slow to go fast"