SunRiders Primus Track Events

[Loren]

Sorry, guys. Things aren't looking so good for Primus. Manatee county officials and apparently a few "local residents" are putting up roadblocks and there's not much the track owner can do right now.

The June event is now officially cancelled. All entries received for that event will be returned by mail. Those who paid cash will receive a refund check from the club.

Things are still up in the air, but we expect that the September Primus event probably won't happen. The December one... maaaaybe, but I'm not really optomistic about that one. We're dealing with governmental red tape and politics, these things take time.

At this point, the SunRiders are looking for other options for the scheduled dates. Our sponsor, Ferman MINI, wants to continue to support these types of events, we just need to find a venue for them.

I know we've touched on this subject in this forum before, but if anyone has any ideas, and especially good contacts for a small track such as Primus, or even a really big autocross site, please let me know.

Right now I can tell you that Sunshine Speedway is too small (for this... we could do a small SPC-type autocross there), Tampa Bay Downs is too expensive ($1500 plus $5M in insurance coverage... the insurance is the killer, it would cost us over $8k... for an autocross!), Tropicana Field is too expensive ($3k+ just to rent). We're trying to get a crew over to the big Oval track in Lakeland (I forget the name) this weekend to check it out and see if we can do anything with that.

Other ideas are welcome!

[Muddy]

Ocala Grand Prix?

[mofugga]

malibu grand prix?

[Loren]

Originally posted by Muddy
Ocala Grand Prix?

That one has been mentioned. I need to find some contacts and see how viable it is. The MINI guys have run there before and enjoyed it.

[Loren]

Originally posted by mofugga
malibu grand prix?

Track is too narrow.

[91rex]

The old Tampa Bay Center parkink lot. GM & Dodge both have had test driver events there along with Audi I believe. I think it is owned by the Tampa Sports Authority.

[neurovish]

Derby Lane
GIR

[Breakey_C5]

Gainesville - the corvette club rented it before and it was rather cheap - we did a basic lapping day around it - I got in more than 85 laps in the one day... then we headed over to the drag strip for an afternoon/evening of straight line playing.

we did it during a weekday - but for 15 of us (total road course drivers) it was only $65 a person. -- weekends would be more, but you could easily have more than 15 people to defray some of the increased cost.

just a thought

adamb

[krekavhts]

I know you may laugh, however I know of a place in Ocala that just might work out for all of you. I am not joking. I would think the bulk of you have heard of the Bay Bottom Crawl. Its a once a year event down in the keys on old roads built for housing development that never happened. Well lucky for us there is a huge housing development started in the 70's that was never finished in Ocala. Actually just south of Ocala closer t Weirsdale. This thing is huge with many different track possibilities. It is currently owned I am my bosses believe by a bank. Its in the middle of damn no where. The track possibilities are endless. Just for S*(&s and giggles here is a satelite image of the place.

http://terraserver.microsoft.com/addressimage.aspx?t=1&s=10&lon=-81.879584181625&lat=29.0111588972&alon=-81.91680830&alat=28.98105614&w=2&ref=A%7c32195

If you would like to know more let me know. The SCCA doesn't allow places like this for sanctioned events, but for you guys it might be perfect. Not to mention it is free. I am going out near this place next week and will take a look at it for you guys if you like.

[neurovish]

:jawdrop:

[agemomai]

Originally posted by Loren
That one has been mentioned. I need to find some contacts and see how viable it is. The MINI guys have run there before and enjoyed it.

good luck, ive been putting half an effort trying to contact these people for a while now and been pretty unsuccessful.

when i was trying to help promote the UsDrift event that was gonna happen there, i eventually found out it got canceled because after we came to test the track, the whole place changed hands and the new owner didnt like the idea or something.. then again, that event fell through for a LOT of reasons, so a while ago i tried to get a hold of them for a floridadrift.com event, but to no avail. im sure they would be cool for just an autox though... i think the word "drift" strikes fear into the hearts of track owners with fragile tarmac..

then again maybe i called the wrong number and sent emails to the wrong address?

[4wdFury]

Originally posted by krekavhts

http://terraserver.microsoft.com/addressimage.aspx?t=1&s=10&lon=-81.879584181625&lat=29.0111588972&alon=-81.91680830&alat=28.98105614&w=2&ref=A%7c32195



holy god that looks fun....:o

[Lola56]

Loren

I live approx 12 miles from this site.

If you want, I could scout it out, take some photos, and give you my impressions of the site.

A couple of miles from my house is a developement called Silver Spring Shores. I occasionaly test my FF there. It was built in the 60's.

The roads there (SSS) are terrible, poor asphalt and alot of patched pot holes. Also, drainage ditches line the roads. Marion County did not have any minimum standards for building roads by developers at that time. Usually, the roads were built using the cheapest means.

The area near Weirdale is somewhat hilly, so the will probably be no place that would view the entire track. Also, a concern, is blocking off any kind of access to the track layout so no one cold enter the track area.


krekavhts

I have been studying the aerial and the topo maps, side by side.

If you back out 4 steps on both views, I see an over grown area to the east, in the green area (noted as Clear Lake) in the Topo map. Could this be the area built in the 70's? The streets in the circular area are not shown in the Topo map, and the area seems to be newly built.

Let me know is you want me to check the area.

Dave

[NitrousAcid069]

Originally posted by krekavhts

http://terraserver.microsoft.com/addressimage.aspx?t=1&s=10&lon=-81.879584181625&lat=29.0111588972&alon=-81.91680830&alat=28.98105614&w=2&ref=A%7c32195






i would like to know directions on how to get to this place....please please post them!

[Loren]

Sorry I fell out for a couple days, guys. For some reason, I didn't get a reply notification until this morning?

---

Anyway, we still haven't made it out to Lakeland to check the big oval track to see what sort of infield options there might be to make an interesting "road course" out of it.

---

Still haven't contacted Ocala GP, I heard that they changed hands, but I think I also heard that it somehow ended up in the control of the same folks who were running it before... or something like that. I haven't even started trying to push buttons on that one yet.

---

Someone from the Central Florida Miata Club once told me about the abandoned housing project in the Ocala area. He said they sometimes do unofficial bonzai runs through there.

I like the look of the aerial shot, it certainly has promise. I think someone mentioned it is "free", is that simply because it's there and uncontrolled? Not good enough for a sanctioned event. We have to have permission of the owner to be there. Something tells me that might be hard to get... unless someone in the owning organization is sympathetic to our cause. If anyone has any leads on this, I'd be interested. And, Lola, if you want to check it out and report on the "reality" of the site, that would be great. Things like pavement condition, off-course obstacles like trees, signs, poles, anything else worth noting. Number of access points to outside streets would be good info, too.

I just spent 10 minutes looking over that area. Unbelievable.

Two more questions. The aerial is from 1999, would be good to know how close any residents are to the site NOW. And are there stop signs and stuff in there... would it be considered a "public road" at all, or is this purely private property that happens to have roads on it?

[Lola56]

Loren

OGP has changed managers. A dolt (liar and cheat) named Wade had been running the place, and he is a real jerk.

Last Feb the builder of the track took over the management of the facility.

For those who want directions, just click on the topo button on the view area. Back out to 32 meters. Alt 27 and 441A is CR 25. The site is east of East Lake Weir, east of US 441, between Ocala and Leesburg.


The Topo mas was created in 1977. This subdivision in the aerial was not listed in the Topo map. That makes me wonder that the area in question is to the east of this aerial.

Dave

[Loren]

Originally posted by Lola56
OGP has changed managers. A dolt (liar and cheat) named Wade had been running the place, and he is a real jerk.

Last Feb the builder of the track took over the management of the facility.
If you've got a phone or email contact, I could use that. Thanks.

For those who want directions, just click on the topo button on the view area. Back out to 32 meters. Alt 27 and 441A is CR 25. The site is east of East Lake Weir, east of US 441, between Ocala and Leesburg.


The Topo mas was created in 1977. This subdivision in the aerial was not listed in the Topo map. That makes me wonder that the area in question is to the east of this aerial.
If you pop up Lake Weir in MapQuest and scroll a bit to the East (there's a smaller lake just East of Lake Weir, our target is just East of that), you'll find all of those roads, complete with street names. I got a better idea of the area from looking at that.

It appears that this is one of the rear "phases" of a large project. It looks like there is possibly even another section there that the roads were cut but the asphalt never laid. (a little NE of our area, you'll see some interesting "crop circle" looking stuff that's all overgrown)

[Lola56]

Loren

Here is the website for Ocala Gran Prix

http://www.ocalagranprix.com/

Dave

[Loren]

Originally posted by Lola56
Here is the website for Ocala Gran Prix
http://www.ocalagranprix.com/

Thanks, Dave. I wasn't sure they'd have a website up, or that it would be accurate with all of the management changes I keep hearing about. I'll check it out.

[krekavhts]

Went to the site today. good luck finding it without GPS. Its damn near impossible to navigate through. You are talking hundreds of acres of roads that go nowhere. I found 1 clearing that looks promising. Most of the site is so over grown that you cannot see safely around corners and there are many trees lining the roads. The section I found, no clue where outside of my GPS bearing, would work well. Big open field with around a 1 mile of roads with enough clearing to see the whole thing. The road is in good condition in that area. No curbs but lots of vegitation. It would take a lot of work for you to run there. I would reccomend to nobody to go out there to run alone. You are in the middle of no where with nothing around and in the event you get lost or worse and there are no real street signs. You have to have a GPS with an up to date road map overlay to venture into this place. Put it to you this way, me and my friend entered the area and drove nearly 4 miles to get to the geocaching point where this clearing is. In that 4 miles of driving through these roads we saw 3 houses. Without the road map gps we would have never gotten out. I can give you directions and a GPS corrdinate to the area of the clearing, but unless there is a group of you going and have GPS don't even try it. Your in the sticks and just watch the movie Deliverance to get an idea of the interesting people you will run across out there.

BTW i took pics of the clearing and will post them once i shrink them down a bit.

[fastforward]

Okay...I'm obviously out of the loop, in a nut shell, what happened to Primus? Insurance problems? Why do the locals have issues with autocross events there? Noise? Its a test and tune facility for god sakes...race carts and formuka Fords practice there, right?...noise is going to happen. I don't understand?

[Loren]

I don't have a lot of answers. All I know is that I got a nasty email from some chick with Manatee County. Why she emailed me in the first place I don't quite understand, but she got my email address from the notice we posted on the gate at the track when the June event got nixed. Apparently some resident took a picture of it and mailed it to her.

Anyway, she explained that Primus does not yet have a Certificate of Occupancy, and nothing can happen out there until they do. Further, she said that Primus was approved as a manufacturer's test facility and ONLY vehicles that were built there are permitted to run the track. She specifically stated that open track events, drivers schools, races any anything of the sort have NOT been approved and that approval for such would require a hearing that likely wouldn't even be scheduled before February.

I realize that she was talking a lot of crap, apparently trying to intimidate me or something. But I know that dealing with governmental politics is a very slow process. So, we're assuming the track won't be available for many months.

In a nutshell, that's all I know. The track owner hasn't told us squat, but he's still not returned any of our phone calls asking about rescheduling the June date... which speaks volumes, I guess.

[krekavhts]

stupid tree huggers

[robofunc]

i'll bet that lady would feel much more relaxed if someone removed the telephone poll from her ass.

[Leonard]

Well then, I think we need to have a Kit car event at primus with all the nastiest loudest non-emissions compliant exhausts (or lack there of) you can find.

:D

Originally posted by Loren
I don't have a lot of answers. All I know is that I got a nasty email from some chick with Manatee County. Why she emailed me in the first place I don't quite understand, but she got my email address from the notice we posted on the gate at the track when the June event got nixed. Apparently some resident took a picture of it and mailed it to her.

Anyway, she explained that Primus does not yet have a Certificate of Occupancy, and nothing can happen out there until they do. Further, she said that Primus was approved as a manufacturer's test facility and ONLY vehicles that were built there are permitted to run the track. She specifically stated that open track events, drivers schools, races any anything of the sort have NOT been approved and that approval for such would require a hearing that likely wouldn't even be scheduled before February.

I realize that she was talking a lot of crap, apparently trying to intimidate me or something. But I know that dealing with governmental politics is a very slow process. So, we're assuming the track won't be available for many months.

In a nutshell, that's all I know. The track owner hasn't told us squat, but he's still not returned any of our phone calls asking about rescheduling the June date... which speaks volumes, I guess.

[Loren]

I was thinking of just having a rally, maybe ending at a park nearby there where we drive past them and make lots of noise with signs saying "wouldn't it be nice if we were at the track instead of your front yard?"

[Leonard]

do you know this lady's name? maybe we can find out where she lives so we can make sure she's inconvenienced by our weekend drive.

[mofugga]

maybe it's just a bad time of the month for her & she'll calm down in a couple days ;)

[Muddy]

Originally posted by Loren
I was thinking of just having a rally, maybe ending at a park nearby there where we drive past them and make lots of noise with signs saying "wouldn't it be nice if we were at the track instead of your front yard?"
You could post up her email address. Then we can sign her up for lots of spam. :nerd:

[Mike]

pix of the site or ban l;ol

[Formula KZ1000]

To bring the subject back to alternative sites, how about Sebring.

Many years ago I went to an auto-X there and they used the runway that CFR now uses for the auto-X plus the front straight as well for a large fast loop. I think it is called the Paddock Course, this is from there website.

The Paddock Course length is 1.4 miles and has a concrete surface with all right hand turns. The backstretch is 300' wide and can be setup for different type courses. This course is used for team testing, driving schools, tire testing and commercials.

I believe we can put something on like we did at primus here if it is not cost prohibitive.

What do you think?

Eddie

[Leonard]

Originally posted by Formula KZ1000
To bring the subject back to alternative sites, how about Sebring.

Many years ago I went to an auto-X there and they used the runway that CFR now uses for the auto-X plus the front straight as well for a large fast loop. I think it is called the Paddock Course, this is from there website.

The Paddock Course length is 1.4 miles and has a concrete surface with all right hand turns. The backstretch is 300' wide and can be setup for different type courses. This course is used for team testing, driving schools, tire testing and commercials.

I believe we can put something on like we did at primus here if it is not cost prohibitive.

What do you think?

Eddie

CFR uses the backstretch once a year in a joint event with the club racers. It is $$expensive$$ to rent.

You would be better off looking at Gainesville Raceway's test track, but it's not cheap either.

[Loren]

What Leonard said. Sebring wants something like $8k per day. The only way CFR can put on an autocross there is that their club has already got the track rented for a club race.

I still think Gainesville is too far away for us. I did call the track in Ocala, but the guy I needed to talk to wasn't in. And he never called me back, go figure. I haven't had much time to devote to this lately, unfortunately.

[Breakey_C5]

really? Gainesville is too far? Oh well, I think it is the perfect site for something like this.

I hope the Ocala place works out then!

adamb

[g-50Cab]

And Sebring get's booked - When I went in April - they told me the track was booked for 38 days straight (as in every single day) - and every weekend until the end of August...

[mofugga]

gainesville is only 20-30 mins farther north of ocala depending on how fast you drive ;)

[Loren]

Originally posted by mofugga
gainesville is only 20-30 mins farther north of ocala depending on how fast you drive ;)

Nothing sucks more than getting a speeding ticket on the way to a driving event! I did that once. Wasn't even in a particular hurry. :mad:

But, anyway, I think the Ocala GP is on the South side of Ocala and GIR is definitely on the NE side of Gainesville. It's a good hour between them.

My concern is that we lost money due to lack of entrants when we had an event that was LOCAL to our club. I don't see that situation improving by moving the events to be more distant.

[krekavhts]

I drive from Ocala to Gainesville everyday. From there to GIR you are looking at about 40 minutes or so. Figure you have about 35 miles on I75 to 39th Street in gainesville, then about 10-15 miles from there to GIR. If you go the suggested 10mph over the speed limit, which is still slow for that part of I75 you would be there quick. 39th is way up there and doesn't have much traffic, and you enter the back way to GIR. At most 50 minutes.

BTW Ocala GP is north west of Ocala right on 44th Street next to the interstate. You would get on the interstate at 27 if you were at Ocala GP which is the northern most I75 exit for Ocala.